Mad Men C to Z S2E4: Three Sundays Transcript

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Mad Men C to Z Transcript for S2:E4   Three Sundays 

Jenna: Hi, I'm Jenna.
Steve: And I'm Steve. Welcome to All Things Mad Men, from Chip and Dip to Zou Bisou.
 
Jenna: We started this podcast to connect to fans like us, who pick up something new each time you watch the show. We break down each episode of Mad Men, from the pivotal moments to our favorite lines.
 
Steve: Be advised our discussions may include spoilers so we can talk about character arcs all the way through the final season.
We won't be gratuitous with the spoilers, but they can pop up from time to time.
Let's get started with Mad Men, C to Z.
 
Jenna: Welcome to season two, episode four of Mad Men: Three Sundays. This episode was directed by Tim Hunter, and written by Matthew Weiner and Andre and Maria Jacquemetton.
 
Steve: The episode opens on April 8, 1962 in a church, and we see Peggy in the pews. She mentions she she isn't feeling well and excuses herself and bumps into Father Gill in the entrance to the church.
 
Jenna: Here we see Peggy being the dutiful daughter going to church, and when she tries to leave, Anita says, no, we're having supper, I need your help.
 
But Peggy leaves anyway. And this priest, this visiting priest she runs into, is Father Gill, played by Colin Hanks. He's best known for roles in Roswell, the Good Guys and Life in Pieces.
He's also Tom Hanks’ son, and he has a small part in the movie That Thing You Do.
 
Steve: As Peggy bumps into Father Gill, you can tell there's a bit of chemistry there between the two of them.
 
Jenna: I was going to ask if you thought there was anything romantic. She finds out he's planning to come to dinner at their house, and she decides she's going to go back into church and she smiles. She doesn't seem so reluctant.
 
I wondered if she just got caught and there's no way out or if she just had an honest conversation with somebody and that was validating. He seems to be genuinely interested in her and what she says instead of dictating to her, which is kind of her experience with her family.

 
Steve: I feel there's a chemistry from watching the scene, and Weiner says in his commentary that there's a chemistry here. So I think that was the intention and I think that's the way it's portrayed in the scene.
 
Jenna: Next, we move into an overhead shot of Betty and Don in their bedroom.
They're asleep and they awaken to a phone call. Betty has a full social calendar planned for this weekend and while she's on the phone, Don is pushing her to cancel.
 
I notice he's always trying to get out of social obligations, and generally so is Peggy. And Betty is super happy that Don is so into her. So she does cancel their barbecue plans, and she asks, what's with you? He can't explain it, but we know he's been with Bobbie Barrett lately, which seems like a weird thing to drive his relationship with Betty closer. What did you think about this?
 
Steve: Yeah. I took it as just a scene of typical domestic life. I mean, they start getting amorous, and then the kids burst in. It's just this easygoing Sunday for a family. And I guess we can forget for a moment that the Drapers have their problems in their marriage.
 
Jenna: We haven't seen Betty and Don have sex since they were together Valentine's Day, and that didn't work out. And now the kids run in, but it seems to go better this time. So maybe there's more happiness in their marriage than we were led to believe for a moment.
 
Steve: Yeah. And I think that duality is something I really like about the writing, because it would be one thing to show that the marriage has got problems, and these fissures touch and affect everything, and it's always horrible and dramatic.
 
And what I like about the writing is it really shows the opposite, that there's just so much that's normal, routine, mundane. It's interspersed with moments of drama or tension, like any relationship.
 
Jenna: Yes, I agree. I think that if they just showed Don as this evil villain who was cheating on Betty and she was an innocent victim all the time, it would be much less interesting and much less real.
 
They do have genuine moments of happiness and romance between them.
And they do have something sometimes, even if it isn't as picture perfect as they try to make it appear.
 
That is the genius of the show, because our lives are more complicated than that. And it's depicting something that is much better than just a fairytale version of perfection and happiness or an evil villain kind of a thing. And not enough shows do that with this kind of subtlety.
 
Steve: Yeah. And I think that complexity is what throws people off. You know, if you really want to cheer for somebody or you really want to root against somebody,
it's problematic when that duality rears its head and you start to see they have their best moments where they're good, and do good things for others or have good motivations, good intentions.
 
And then it's problematic the other way when, you know, you see them at their worst and they're being abusive or cruel. I love that complexity and duality, and you can never settle in comfort. Because you really don't know what's coming next and what version you're going to see of a favorite character here.
 
Jenna: Absolutely.
 
Steve: The scene morphs then to Sally making drinks. We see Don and Betty sitting in the living room. The kids are being kids. Bobby touches the stereo and Betty's agitated by that . . . banishes them to go off and watch TV.
 
A song comes on and Betty asks Don to get up and dance with her.
 
Jenna: There's a lot going on in this scene.
 
Sally fixes a drink for Don and she goes, here's number two, sir. And he goes, thank you, Jeeves. So we know that this is a routine. So she's eight. The drink she fixes is maybe seven-eighths alcohol and splash of tomato juice.
 
Steve: So, yeah, it's. It's a really, really stiff. When you see how much vodka goes into it.
 
Jenna: Betty is reading the book, or the short story, I guess, a Diamond as Big as the Ritz, which Arthur Chase mentioned to her at the stables in the last episode.
So he's intruding on her family time at home and her thoughts at least a little bit here.
 
And I love this question, too. Sally says, why are we in the living room? And Betty goes, because we live here. But you can tell this is a fancy kind of unused space because they don't spend that much time together. So it's notable that we just see this sort of regular life going on.
 
And then, as you mentioned, a song comes on the stereo and it's Blue Room. It's by Perry Como, and the song is from 1948. It's about how nice married life would be from the point of view of the man.
 
Betty says she loves this song and she invites Don to dance.
And he goes, I thought we weren't doing anything today, like. Like dancing with his wife in the living room is such a big plan or ask. But they do dance together and it's a nice moment seeing them together.
 
Steve: Yeah, it is. And I think it gives us an insight into, you know, Betty's nostalgia for her younger days. And they. They have a bit of patter back and forth about her in high school with their second drink in hand.
 
Jenna: It's also our second catch in the series of Go Watch tv. We know the Draper kids get told this a lot over the course of the series. And this is our second observation.
 
I just notice here in season one, Betty seems to be a much more loving parent. I mean, you probably wouldn't want to trust her with plastic bag safety from the dry cleaning . . . or maybe driving.
But here in season two, she's pivoting away from a more sweet mother role. And she particularly seems to be blaming Bobby for every little thing.
 
Steve: I would also keep Betty away from air rifles and projectile weapons of any type.
 
Yeah, it's. We. We've seen a bit of edge here with Betty. It comes up repeatedly.
It seems to be driven a bit by Bobby as the youngest, misbehaving, touching things he shouldn't and then denying it.
 
And it seems that it's the combination of the agitation of not just doing what he's not supposed to, but his denial and dishonesty around it that triggers Betty.
 
Jenna: And I also wonder if that is meant to be a stand-in for her frustration with Don, this constant denial of what's right in front of her eyes.
 
Steve: Yeah, and it seems that she lays that weight on him in a way as she complains about his lack of participation in the discipline of the children,
that, you know, he needs to take a bigger role there and be the heavy,
and that things like dishonesty are far more serious, even if the matters about which Bobby's being dishonest are rather trivial.
 
This does seem to have a direct connection to some of the frictions the two of them have.
 
Jenna: Yeah, that's going to pop up a lot in the course of this episode. So more to come there.
 
The next scene takes us to Peggy Olson's family's house, and they are thrilled to host the visiting priest, Father Gill. Anita is really dressed up and it's a big deal.
And we see her husband Gerry for the first time. He does not seem to be as invested. His back is out.
 
And as Father Gill comes in, Anita explains to the priest, unnecessarily, I think, well, he watched the baby, so he did his part. And the fact that she says this suggests that he probably does not do his part very often. He goes, I'm sorry, I've gotta lie down. And she shoots a look at him because he's not supposed to be lying down when this important guest is visiting their house, right?
 
It makes us think that Anita's life is probably not all that creatively fulfilled here.
 
Steve: Yeah, it's definitely not a marital bliss on her side,
but you can tell how thrilled her mother is to host Father Gill.
And just a shout out here to the costumes and set design. They're really perfect.
 
Jenna: So they invite him to say grace before dinner.
And he's a little bit more modern. He's younger and his version of grace is lovely,
but it's not the traditional thing. And so it doesn't count. So Peggy's mother says,
“That was beautiful. Are you going to say grace now?”
 
So he stands up and does it the traditional way. And you can see in the background there's a picture of JFK, as you say, the set design here. And those details are perfection.
 
Steve: After dinner, they're sitting at the table and smoking and having a conversation. He's of the young generation, just as Peggy is. And there's all this change going on in society.
 
So you can see how this is rippling through and affecting, you know, the most traditional of roles. You know, a Catholic priest, for example. Even as the older generation, you know, Peggy's mom is clinging to the trappings of sort of how things are and how they're meant to be.
 
Jenna: Yes. And he says that he plays soccer, and when he was in Rome, he learned how to play the mandolin, which is maybe not what you would conventionally expect of a priest.
 
And Peggy says, I always wanted to go to Rome.
And right after that, her mother says, Peggy works in Manhattan. And I thought this was an interesting callback to her line about people in Manhattan being better because they want things they haven't seen.
 
Of course, Peggy is the one in that room who dreams of going somewhere far away.
 
Steve: We also get a little glimpse at some of the friction between Peggy and her sister, who's obviously a little jealous and put out that her mom is gushing over Peggy.
 
Jenna: Peggy's mother does take an opportunity here to brag on Peggy and her work. She's clearly proud of her.
 
And it's so funny how when you're looking at this scene and you see somebody else's family, you can see all the ways they perform for their special guest and all the ways they have scar tissue with each other.
 
And it's harder for people in it to see how they're trapped in patterns of behavior.
 
Steve: But again, I love the writing because that is just so true and real in terms of our lives and relationships. So I love the authenticity that I feel when I watch.
 
Jenna: It captures it with such specificity, and yet it's so universal, it's genius.
 
The next scene takes us to Roger and Mona having dinner with their daughter Margaret and her fiance, Brooks. Brooks Hargrove is played by Derek Ray, recognizable from Rebel and State of Affairs.
 
Margaret, who has a rocky relationship with her father - from the very first episode, they were talking about each other - her mother probably raised her very much like the way Betty was raised. But against all odds, she really does seem to be genuinely in love with Brooks.
 
She has a rather unconventional wish. She does not want to have a big wedding. And given how she was raised, this seems maybe like she wants to prove something to her father, like this wish is not really genuine, but petulant. What did you think?
 
Steve: I thought it was a great scene for what it tells us about the mindsets of Roger, Mona and Margaret. I think Roger has categorized Margaret as being this petulant, spoiled daughter who, for whatever reason, wants to tilt against her mother's ideal of what a wedding looks like.
 
When Mona reminisces about the wedding and what she loved about it, again, the writing is so perfect, the beauty and the value that Mona places on it.
 
And what was striking to me is how Roger doesn't seem to get drawn in at all to Mona's reminiscences about things that are so treasured to her, these treasured memories that she wants for her daughter.
 
And yet Roger seems bored and uninterested. I wanted to ask if you had a thought about Roger's attitude here.
 
Jenna: I actually was more interested in this idea about parents and their expectations for their children and how they're different. Mona talks about how perfect her wedding is. And it seems like a really authentic example of this kind of conflict: how parents have dreams and expectations for their children about what will make them happy, even if the children have different dreams for themselves.
 
And we saw this with Rachel and her father, and Betty and her mother, and Pete and his father, and certainly Peggy and her family.
 
So it's another example here of, and maybe again, the youth movement and how the times are changing.
 
Mona does not have - I don't think it's especially manipulative or nefarious intentions here. She loved her wedding, and she tells Margaret, I don't want you to miss that.
 
And for me, Roger was harder to read. He argues for Mona's side, I felt like. But he looks at this young couple and how they're going to order the garlic mussels together, and he seems uncharacteristically quiet.
 
Steve: I get a vibe that Roger's envious.
 
My sense is Roger is lamenting the fact that he's not young and in love.
He's seeking that sort of romantic freshness and excitement. And he sees his daughter has it with her fiance. And I think he envies it.
 
And I think this is a very selfish scene for Roger's character in that that is where his head is at. So even as his daughter's expressing her wishes and even as his wife is expressing her memories of their wedding together, in which he's an integral part, his head is elsewhere in this.
 
Jenna: Weiner says that Roger misses having this love that he sees between Margaret and Brooks. And I wonder if he and Mona ever had that. He seems like a bit of a romantic. “I'm glad I got to roam those hills” notwithstanding.
 
And Don also had that in Marriage of Figaro last season when he had the video camera and he caught the married neighbors in a genuine kiss. Or when he caught Midge and Roy in the Polaroid and how they were in love.
 
When they're confronted with these genuine feelings, both Don and Roger seem ill at ease. But for Roger, I wondered if it was also discomfort about how different his daughter is from him in terms of what he expects and what she wants.
 
Steve: And I think, you know, Mona lays out exactly what she hopes for her daughter to experience, so she really displays where she's coming from. With Roger, it does seem much more ambivalent.
 
Is he thinking, well, I'll save some money if we don't have a traditional wedding?
Is he thinking, his daughter is impulsive and just tilting against them for the sake of being contrarian?
It is sort of a funky state we see him in. And any or all of these agendas could be part of his thinking.
 
Jenna: And Roger at work is so dialed in and quippy and fast thinking, just not that quiet and reflective. So this definitely seems like a big shift for him.
 
Steve: Yeah, agreed.
 
Jenna: So Father Gill has dropped Peggy at the train station and we see them in the car.
He asks her for advice on his sermon and she seems reluctant. But eventually she does give him a couple of short tips.
 
Steve: Yeah, and these all seem very applicable to her work as a copywriter. So, you know, be prepared, have confidence in what he's selling.
 
It's interesting that she makes that comparison because I don't think Father Gill probably perceives himself as selling things. And she also gives him the tip about making eye contact.
 
Jenna: There were two really great lines in this scene, I thought,
when Peggy tries to beg off answering the question, she says,
I don't know that I'm your audience.
 
And he answers with, you were leaving.
Her saying, I don't know if I'm your audience is, again, it's her saying,
I'm not like the other people who go to mass in this town.
 
She's differentiating herself even here, even in this conversation.
And then she gives the on-point advice about presenting. And then she asks,
don't they have stuff you're supposed to talk about? Which seems like a very layperson kind of deferential question to an expert.
 
She says, maybe be simpler. Give us a chance of understanding.
So it's interesting how the power dynamic seems to shift back and forth between them where she's the expert in one moment and he's the expert in the next.
 
Steve: And again, I do think we get a sense of there is some electricity between the two of them. They. They're both young, alone in the car, you know, he draws her out to give her input on the sermon, which, again, feels like it's strengthening a bond that's forming between the two of them.
 
Jenna: But it's very appropriate. It's an interesting thing that as an audience, we have an expectation when we have a young man and a young woman in a car together that the explanation must be romantic.
 
Sort of like taking us out of the scene for a second, but looking at Peggy and Don as being leads on the show, and that there must be something romantic between them because that's what we expect, right?
 
Where another thing that Mad Men does really well is it shows us so many different types of relationships. And I think it is plausible that two people could have a connection that isn't romantic.
 
I know that Weiner says in the commentary it's intended, but again, I don't know if there needs to be romantic electricity for this relationship to be interesting and meaningful to each of them.
 
Steve: Yeah, but let me express it in the contrary, then.
This is not a cursory, detached interaction between the two of them. So there is something more going on here because that's how it could have played out and it doesn't.
 
I take your point. We've been trained by popular culture to look at scenes in a certain way. But that said, I do think Weiner and the writers here are dancing in a zone between maybe what we've been taught versus versus something that was more arm's length and detached, because it's not that either. So in my opinion, it is in this gray zone somewhere.
 
Jenna: I'm open to that. I just also think that when you look at the neighbors who are coming to visit for dinner and how traditional and the older generation expectations that are there, and then you have two young people who see the potential in the world to reshape it and do something differently, I think that can be a genuine, exciting connection.
 
To find somebody who thinks like you or who is open to possibilities like you.
That's valid. That's a connection, too. I take your point. I mean, Weiner's in charge, so he says it's romantic electricity -- fair -- it's romantic electricity, then, I guess.
 
Steve: Well, and we also have the benefit of the hindsight. Cause we know how this show plays out. We know the arc of both of these characters from front to finish. I think I do detect what Weiner's talking about here.
 
Jenna: I mean, I have anxiety when I probably when I watch it the first time because you're just like, oh, no, you can't do this. Like, this is really not okay. Right? It's so taboo to have a relationship between them.
 
 
So we have three Sundays and three Bobby break-it moments in this episode.
And when we shift to Don and Betty and Sally and Bobby, they're all on Don and Betty's bed and they're laughing and goofing around together after a Sunday at home together.
 
And Bobby jumps on Don and Betty's bed and it breaks.
Not the most surprising symbolism given Don and Betty's challenge to stay connected.
 
Steve: And we can see that the parents are still somewhat drunk from their their day drinking. So their default is to send the kids to bed. And then they realize they haven't fed the kids. So Betty's going to go down to make them grilled cheese. But we can see again here a flash of Betty's anger and frustration with Bobby.
 
Jenna: She's immediately irritated with him. Great, you broke it. You were being wild in the house.
I don't understand why she gets so instantly upset with Bobby.
 
Maybe she feels like good times are so fragile or few and far between. She definitely makes it worse by her reaction.
 
Steve: Yeah, it does feel like an overreaction, given that it is a silly moment of sort of family frolicking. And when it goes wrong, suddenly it's all pinned on Bobby's back.
 
Jenna: Our next scene is at a restaurant. We've got Ken and Pete charming Marty Hasselback from Gorton's as they're sitting there laughing at his jokes and trying to be the charming account men they are.
 
We see a woman walk by. This is Vicky, played by Marguerite Moreau. You might have seen her in the Mighty Ducks or in Grey's Anatomy.
 
Steve: It becomes clear that Vicky is a call girl who's been hired to look after Marty and ensure he has a good time. He's suitably impressed and they start hitting it off.
Then Roger walks in. She introduces herself as Marty's wife.
 
Jenna: When Roger shows up at the dinner table, he first does the dutiful “love that frozen scrod” to the Gorton’s guy, which is a great line.
 
And then he turns to Vicky, and he is so immediately taken with her.
And it's interesting then when Vicky says, oh, I'm Marty's wife. He just goes along with it, even though he's just met her.
 
And she is in such total control in that scene, she's flirting with Roger actively, while she also flirts with Marty. And both of them are there for it.
 
Steve: Yeah, I like the way Vicky's character is written because she does seem to be larger than a call girl. She's a businesswoman, and she's managing her business,
leveraging her assets, and playing the game in a way that's going to make her clients happy and lead to additional business.
 
So she does come across as a power player, which is maybe not what you would expect out of a call girl in a scene like this.
 
Jenna: We were looking at Roger observing his daughter and her fiance,
and when he sees Vicky and Marty together, he can't help himself from asking, how long have you two been married?
She says, five years. And he says, aha, second time around. That explains it.
 
 
In our next scene, we're at Don's office. Bobbie Barrett shows up with an idea for a new television show.
It's a hidden camera show, like Candid Camera, she says,
only she wants to call it Grin and Bear it because Jimmy will star in it and he's, you know, not nice.
 
Candid Camera was a show that went on the air in 1948, making it one of the earliest American TV shows. The same age as the Ed Sullivan show and before I Love Lucy.
 
So Bobbie's there to ask Don about the mechanics of the TV show idea,
and he won't accept involvement in the project other than to smooth the way a little bit. So why do you think he's not interested in partnering with her on this? He would have loved an excuse to spend more time with Rachel on something like this.
 
Steve: I like that question.
I think it's out of his swim lane. I mean, he's not a producer, and he's not especially knowledgeable about television.
 
I suspect that he thinks Bobbie is just coming in here to have an excuse to stop by and lock the door to his office.
It is kind of an odd dynamic between the two of them because he doesn't crap all over her idea, but he also offers some criticisms and blockers, and then he kind of flips and starts suggesting some constructive ideas that she seems to take and do course and feel that those are helpful.
 
Then it becomes clear that she's interested in something more for her visit.
 
Jenna: Yes, and we see Joan, who's stepping in as Don's secretary. So she notices the door locks and she makes a face And I'm actually a little surprised by this face from the woman who told Peggy, this is his private life. It's the way these men are. It's why we love them.
 
But here she looks more like, ugh, not again about it.
 
Steve: The other thing I would say too is this is a show that, you know, wasn't airing on HBO or something where they could get very explicit with the sexuality.
 
So just the, the brilliance of Bobbie tossing the jacket on the ground at Don's feet as he's seated in the armchair was, was just a suitably sexy, sleazy shot to make it very clear where this is headed without showing where this is headed.
 
Jenna: So to speak.
 
Steve: Yeah.
 
Jenna: Next we get a super short but also funny scene.
The way Pete delivers this line about Roger, There is a Mrs. Hasselbeck and that's not her.
And also the way Ken is so eager to offer up his many phone numbers. Those are both so funny.
 
But it does call to mind how Pete's father said his job in advertising was whining and whoring. Pete did set up a meeting with his, quote, cousins for the Bethlehem Steel guy earlier.
 
And now here we have Vicky and Marty as part of his account management job.
You know, Roger's coming in to try to go to the gorton meeting at 3 o', clock, hoping he can run into Vicky. You can really see his disappointment.
 
Steve: Yeah, I love the acting here in this scene, the sort of innuendo as they update Roger on the situation.
 
I also wondered, when Ken offers the number, if Roger is interested, but doesn't want it to be obvious to Ken and Pete and knows that the invoices cross his desk so he'll be able to spot the expense anyway.
 
Jenna: Oh, I think so. Definitely. He seems a bit embarrassed that he missed this and he certainly doesn't want Ken and Pete involved in any of his relationships.
 
 
Steve: From here, Don returns home for the following scene.
He gets a nice greeting from Sally. It's clear Betty isn't in a good mood. Bobby's broken the record player.
 
He's lied again, when confronted with what he did. Betty's basically tattling on Bobby and demanding that Don, as the father, go set him straight.
 
Jenna: Earlier, the bed was broken, representing their sex life. And now the record player. And remember, Don and Betty had been dancing to a song that Betty remembered from high school earlier in this episode.
 
So having this broken is another reminder that this picture-perfect married life she had once dreamed about isn't working. So it's like, okay, now the romance is officially gone.
 
So Betty is really harping on it that Don, in this classic wait till your father gets home moment, that he's got to do something about this. So she sends Don upstairs. He opens the door, and we see little Bobby sitting there. His feet are dangling off the bed because he's little and he's in his jammies.
 
He looks up at Don, and Don is here to deliver the punishment.
 
Steve: Yeah, what a thankless job. So, obviously, Betty is tired of always being the heavy here.
 
But I think we can also sympathize as viewers that to come home from a long day at work, even if Bobbie Barrett was visiting, and then have to be the heavy on your young child who's. Who's just got his natural fear of his father.
 
I think it's kind of interesting the way Don disciplines him because he says, you know, your mother says, you broke the hi fi. I believe her. He skips over any sort of debate or honesty or confession from Bobby and just leaps to the verdict that he's guilty of breaking the hi fi.
 
And then for the discipline, there's really nothing coming. He just says, don't do it again. And Bobby's like, okay.
 
Jenna: Betty is definitely not happy with the way Don delivers punishment to Bobby. She starts talking about spanking and how it teaches kids right from wrong.
And she says this line, do you think you'd be the man you are today if your father didn't hit you?
 
Steve: I think that's really one of the great lines of the episode because it just cuts in so many directions.
 
I have to say, personally, Jon Hamm probably isn't my favorite actor on this series,
But I really think that stricken look on his face in response to her saying that to him, I think it's just sensational acting and really conveys just how fraught that question is coming from Betty.
 
Jenna: Of course, Don avoids the conversation. He says, can I get something to eat? He doesn't look at Betty, moves past her.
 
It makes sense that he avoids this, because Betty is making huge assumptions about how Don's father parented him to meet expectations for his successful life.
It's not the case at all.
 
The audience, I think, can't help wonder when she says that, what man would he be today if he had – if he hadn't been hit and he had been loved, what difference would that make for the Dick Whitman / Don Draper we know?
 
Steve: Yeah. And not only that, how clueless is she about his upbringing? Again, it just emphasizes this point. They've had two children. They've been married for years, and she doesn't know these basic truths about his upbringing at this point.
 
And not that that's her fault, because he's not forthcoming with them either,
but it, I think it really underlines the tragedy of their relationship. You know, how strong can any relationship be when you're missing these fundamental core pieces of what makes a person who they are and you're just operating on assumptions about them?
 
Jenna: And I know it's a different time period, but it's never made sense to me to tell kids hitting is bad and then hit them to teach them a lesson, just what?
But here is Betty is espousing this viewpoint, which I'm sure was very much a part of the time period.
 
Steve: Yeah. And the other part I would add to that is a lot of times corporal punishment emerges from the rage and anger of the parent doing the punishment.
 
In this case, Don isn't pleased that the hi fi was broken, but I don't get the sense that it especially winds him up emotionally, you know, so he lacks that anger.
 
And given what a central piece that that is to spanking in most cases,
it further reinforces this notion of apparently he doesn't want to be doing that to his children because of the harm it did to him growing up. And, and as well, he lacks the standard motivation for it. He's not enraged at hearing the hi fi got broken today.
 
Jenna: But I also don’t think Betty wants him to get really angry and lose control and spank him and hurt him.
 
But this, this idea that it's logical that you will go up and calmly administer a spanking and hit somebody and be like, okay, that is your just punishment. I'm going to hit you and you're going to be better for it. That is just weird.
 
Steve: Yeah. But I, I, I do like the writing for the time period because I think that standard and expectation was the default for many, many people at that time.
 
 
Jenna: Our next Sunday in this episode is Palm Sunday. We see Don making pancakes, which is a pretty family guy thing for him to do.
 
He steps away to answer the phone, and Bobby burns his chin on the griddle. And Matthew Weiner in the commentary says that this actually happened to him when he was a kid.
 
Steve: Yeah. And again, it's just on brand for Bobby. Right. He's young, he's, he's full energy, he's into everything. Don is on the phone with Duck, who's calling them all in to work on the AA presentation.
 
Out of all this, Betty's going to have to take Bobby to the emergency, which means Sally has to go to the office. This doesn't float Don's boat. But Sally is thrilled and claps her hands at the prospect of going to work with her dad.
 
Jenna: I noticed that when Betty says she's going to take Bobby to the emergency room, she looks at his injury, but she doesn't hug him and she doesn't say sweet things to him.
 
She just complains at Don for having to go into work. So it's not a great mothering moment for Betty.
 
Betty says that Don has to take Sally. Again, as you say, it's so cute when she claps and she looks at Don, she's like, yeah, this is the best thing ever.
 
But I don't know if you caught that Bobby is being pulled away and he complains, I want to go with Daddy. And we can't - we really can't blame him.
 
This contrast between how Don is already exhausted by this day and they haven't even had pancakes yet, and he looks at Sally and she's super gleeful about going into work on a Sunday with her dad. And he could not be more opposite.
 
Steve: I didn't notice that neither of them console Bobby for his, you know,
somewhat serious burn if he's going to go to the emergency. So I think that's a great catch because I think it shows just how wrapped up they are in their own things here at this moment that they're missing.
 
On the parenting side of, hey, your young child is injured. The first step is comfort,
even as you got to address all the other implications of what's just occurred.
 
Jenna: And Betty was also throwing a really quick barb, too, walking through with the toolbox, because that's an allusion to how Don has not yet fixed the bed. And he says, I'll do it.
 
And so there is this tension between all the things that are broken and she's trying to point them out and demanding that he fix them.
 
Steve: The next scene is Father Gill stopping by Anita's house to drop off a copy of his proposed sermon for Peggy. Meanwhile, nobody's putting any focus on Anita.
 
Jenna: I have to say, before this, I feel like Anita's comments to Peggy have been supportive of the mother. Like, she's not going to be around forever, you know, you should go to church, it makes her happy.
 
But this scene here, this reaction to this new priest in town getting help from Peggy, this seems like something else. But in contrast, their mother is really approving and she says, oh, it's so nice he's taking an interest in her. So watching this slow burn is great.
 
Steve: Across this episode, we cut back to the office. As Don and Sally arrive, everybody's already there.
 
I like the time capsule of this where Don basically hands Sally off to Joan. And now Don walks into the conference room where Duck is already walking through the plan.
 
Everybody's in various outfits of whatever they were wearing when they got called into the office. So. So it was great job by the costuming there. We both really loved Pete in his tennis outfit.
 
Jenna: Backing up a little bit when Sally shows up at the office, this is a whole exercise in how she does not fit into this world at all.
 
You know, Don's whole parenting thing. Sally, be good for Ms. Holloway. And to Joan, keep her away from the paper cutter. Like, that's all you need to know about Sally.
 
And Sally grins, and she's so thrilled to be there. And this moment where Joan smiles back, you can see she's not at all into this task. And I hadn't thought about this before, but last season she's giving advice to Peggy about when Betty's kids come in and she says, get some Hershey bars from the cart for the little brats.
 
So this is a cue that even though women are assumed to have a natural knack for caretaking, Joan is not so child-centered here.
 
Steve: Really it would probably be faster just to list all the women in this series who have a knack for childcare.
 
Jenna: So true. And I like that Harry gets this one line in the whole episode because in the meeting, Duck stops and he looks at him and he goes, who are you?
And he goes, I'm the head of the television department.
 
And he's still sounds like he doubts the truth of it, but we see it really did happen. This job he created last episode and celebrated with Jennifer is actually a thing.
 
Steve: So, yeah, I also liked when Duck requests a sneak peek of what Don's angle is going to be from creative. And it's pretty clear that Don doesn't have an angle yet at this point. So they are in the 11th hour rushing around to prepare something,
and they have nothing at this time.
 
So you get a sense, I think, of how it works here that it's rush, rush, and full of pressure and stress.
 
Jenna: Duck is also pushing Don to say, I say that we present all three ideas. He says, it will leave no room for doubt, that, you know, we can handle this. And we already know that Don - Don's philosophy is not to do that. He says, you know, she'd pick one strategy and go with that. But he doesn't fight Duck in the room. He says, creative - in my office.
 
And as they make that move, Don walks by Sally and Joan with his team and goes into his office and he doesn't even look at his daughter. He is full on at work.
Steve: And then out of this scene, we cut to Sally and Joan, and Sally's talking about how large Joan's breasts are. So it's just. Again, I love the writing. It's so comedic and typical of the ridiculous conversations you're going to have with a young girl.
 
Jenna: It's so uncomfortable and so inappropriate and so Mad Men.
 
Steve: And Joan's reaction to your earlier point. She's just trying to survive here and minimize the carnage of these sorts of things. So it's just the perfect look on Christina Hendricks's face.
 
Jenna: I wish I could say it gets better, but it'll get more awkward.
 
So creative is in Don's office, and you can see here Sal has not done art that excites Don. And Paul has this great line about how it's the best menu he's ever written.
And Don goes, it's in French. How do I know it's right?
And Paul goes, it's right.
 
I also noticed Peggy - she's on top of the details for her part of the presentation. She's prepared, she's waiting for a logo decision.
She's communicating crisply and without ego here. She really belongs on this team.
 
Steve: Yeah, she's a pure pro.
And they're all rowing in the same direction. So although it's tough getting the blowback from Don as he rips on some of the ideas and pushes back and gives direction, I think we get a nice illustration of the creative process and how it is both communal, but also driven by Don with the whip in hand.
 
Jenna: There's a nice Mad Men transition as Don's creative team leaves his office and we see Don close the door. And we switch over to Roger opening a door to a hotel room. And Vicky enters. So he found a way to get her number.
 
Steve: And very similar to the earlier scene with Vicky, she seems very much like a power player here. You know, she's not just pandering to whatever Roger wants.
 
They enter into negotiation, and it's clear that Roger is looking for something a little more romantic, a little more involved than perhaps the typical gig. And Vicky monetizes that and extracts some concessions and additional compensation,
which makes Roger happy. And then they proceed.
 
Jenna: He says, how about I pay double plus car fare, and I'll assume you live very far away. But he says, I want everything I want. He seems to want kissing. He wants a romantic fantasy.
 
He's so spoiled. We talked about how Don has five approaches to conflicts, and it feels like Roger really just has two: humorous deflection and throwing money at it. And if possible, he uses the approaches simultaneously.
 
Steve: I wondered what you thought of Roger in this episode, because, again,
it feels like he's indulging a selfish fantasy here.
He doesn't show any sort of empathy or buy into his daughter's young love. He just seems to envy it and wish he had more of it himself. I think Roger comes off pretty badly here.
 
He's just indulging selfish fantasies. And I would argue, you know, again, we talk so much about, oh, Betty is a child and being childish. But it seems Roger's fantasy here is awfully childish for someone of his age and maturity. What he has in his life and then what he's proceeding to do here, he certainly is.
 
Jenna: It's not clear to us, because we don't see all of Roger all the time. But it is suggested that after his heart attack, and he said he loved Mona and he rediscovered that, we haven't seen him with anybody else.
 
So it's kind of odd that your daughter's happiness and engagement should be the trigger that puts you over the edge to say, oh, my own marriage is unfulfilling and not enough for me and I need to go seek some other type of relationship outside of it.
 
Steve: Yeah, he's purchasing a pantomime of it, which, okay, fine, that's what he's doing. But okay, Roger, does that really satiate you? Does that fill the hole inside your soul? I can't imagine it really does.
 
Jenna: Also, let's remember, while everybody is working hard at the office, Roger gets to do whatever Roger wants to do.
 
Back at the office, Sally is wandering around. She sees a picture of Paul's girlfriend, Sheila. So we found out they're still together even after they had the fight.
And when Sally sees the picture, she assumes that Sheila is his maid and she's only 8.
 
But she has all this privilege as Don's daughter, so nobody can be rude to her or correct her, even when she's asking these very embarrassingly personal questions.
 
Steve: I really sympathize with Paul in this scene because she said something totally inappropriate to him about asking whether he kisses her, does he lay on top of her?
Paul knows he's got to get out of this conversation.
 
And I love his choice here where he says, look, I've got to get working or your daddy's going to be very angry at me.
 
Jenna: It was the best possible way to get out of it. There was really no - there was no smooth exit there.
 
 
Our next scene is really short. They've had lunch brought into the office, and Joan says something to the secretaries lined up like, hold on a minute, girls. It'll be your turn soon.
 
And we see Peggy is working and she's eating, and the secretaries are side eyeing her. And she gets to eat first with the men, and then all the secretaries get to eat last.
 
Steve: Well, she gets to eat first with the men, but that's just because it's all men except for her who are part of the team. So I think that's an important distinction. And as you pointed out earlier, she is one of them now. And that hierarchy in the dining reflects it.
 
Jenna: I really appreciate the fact that Peggy doesn't return the looks. She's not cowed by the looks. She doesn't even seem to notice them. She's so focused on her work. So whatever bad feelings they're harboring about her, she doesn't have any time for it. Literally, today. She's work focused.
 
 
Steve: As the scene goes forward, Bert steps in some chewing gum that's on the carpet and unloads and fires one of the secretaries who's chewing gum on the spot.
Duck comes in behind and tells her to go get something to eat and that Bert will have forgotten about firing her come Monday.
 
Jenna: This is maybe a 45-second scene, but it does so much good work. And there's a setup for this. We understand everybody is expected to take off their shoes and go around in stocking feet in Bert's office.
 
So here's Bert wandering around the office in his socks, which, if he were wearing shoes, you know, the gum wouldn't have been such a thing. And he's so offended by this.
 
He says, you there, chewing your cud. And she has this great line. She goes, how could it be my gum? My gum is in my mouth!
 
As you say, Duck comes to handle it, and he does it so deftly. He says, thank you for getting him out of the office. He gives her some dinner money. Lose the gum.
It's a lot of work happening in this very short scene.
 
Steve: Yeah. And Duck's role in this episode is rather small, but at every turn, he is on point, focused, looking after the things he's supposed to be looking out for. He's positive. You see him congratulating and being supportive of everyone around him.
He's really kind of a shining star for somebody that we know has this personal friction with Don Draper.
 
Jenna: In contrast, Don walks out of his office and sows chaos. He comes into the main office area. He announces a complete creative change. Inspired by JFK's speech, he says, ask not about Cuba. Ask not about the bomb. We're going to the moon.Throw everything out. That crash happened to someone else.
 
And you can see him trying to talk his way into a new truth. And it throws everybody into frustration to try to adjust to this new story he wants to tell.
 
I love that they have this scene because this is very true to Don's personal brand about, I can talk my way into defining the situation. But when you're trying to work with a team, it doesn't work. You need a clear vision, and you can't just reach into your pocket and spin out the story as we've seen it work for him.
Sometimes this kind of business presentation requires collaboration and communication. And weirdly, for a guy who's good with the words, man, he's not doing that very well here. Duck is the one doing that well.
 
Steve: I love the line from Duck when he says, our job is to bend down the branch and let Draper pick the fruit again. Just seems to be Duck clarifying things for Pete about what their job actually is and to stay out of the way now, because creative's coming down to the wire, and the ball is in Don Draper's hands with his team,
even though his team is as frustrated and perplexed as anyone.
 
Jenna: We also see Sally looking on, listening to conversations that people are having about her father, for good and for bad.
And we see her pick up a leftover glass of alcohol from a table.
 
Steve: One thing that came across to me is both Don and Peggy's characters are trying to create a new future for themselves individually, and a large part of that is leaving behind their past.
 
It's funny that this parallels in the ad campaign that Don's come up with was just like American Airlines with their crash of Flight one. We're going to leave the past behind us and just focus on the future.
 
Jenna: Let's pretend we know what 1963 looks like.
And Sal says, what does that mean?
 
Because he's not clear. They don't know. But Peggy and Don have vision, and they can work it out and figure it out and they will get there.
 
But everybody else needs them to be more clear, and it's just not as collaborative as they need it to be. So they're great solo artists, and they're great with other people who get them. Just for this corporate culture, it's not the best fit.
 
The scene shifts back to Roger at the hotel with Vicky, and he convinces her to have dinner with him. She says, have you been to Lutece? And he says, I have. I think you'd like it.
 
And I get the feeling maybe he wanted to have the dinner just as much as the sex. It feels like he just wants somebody to be interested in him.
 
Steve: Yeah, I had that vibe as well.
And again, I just love the Vicky character that she's begging off and she's meeting a friend.
 
And then when Roger convinces her and when they're going to one of the finest restaurants in Manhattan, then suddenly Vicky is able to go and seems to buy into like, okay, I'm going to play this role for you, and we're going to walk over there in the rain, catering to Roger's fantasy here.
 
Jenna: Do you feel sorry for him here, or are you judgy at him for being spoiled while everybody else is working so hard?
 
I have to admit, I feel pity for him. Cause he's, he's looking for something and he's not gonna find it here. He can get it for an hour.
 
Steve: Yeah, yeah, I, I, I agree with that. Pity it. I think when you think it through, it's rather pathetic.
 
But I think Roger is such a dashing character. He comes from affluence. He can have whatever he wants. I think that glosses and hides all the pathetic aspects until you look closely and really pay attention to it.
 
And I totally agree with your point.
What is this you're doing, Roger? It's a sugar high. It's not real, it's fake.
And that's how you're going to choose to spend your time. Because to your point, he could be at the office looking to participate or support in some way, or he could be back with his family, but that's, he's not made either of those choices.
 
 
Jenna: Back at the office, we see Sally sleeping on the couch, and Don picks her up to take her home, and an empty glass falls out of her hand. The secretaries pretend not to see.
 
Don doesn't really say much about it.
Thank you for babysitting. They're just gonna let that go.
It would be amazing if Sally escapes becoming an alcoholic after she's been taught to make these stiff drinks for her parents and been around all these leftover glasses of drinks all day at the office.
 
Steve: Well, and as an admin in the office, having to babysit the a child,
you know, is anybody unhappy that the child gets buzzed and falls asleep and thus, you know, can just be left on the couch without being an additional burden or hassle? You know it works out well for everybody, except maybe Sally.
 
Jenna: It's a really bad case study for parenting this episode.
 
In the next scene, we see Peggy's mom answering the phone, and she passes it to Anita, who answers it reluctantly. Peggy's calling.
 
Even though Anita didn't want to take the call, she seems friendly to Peggy.
When they hang up, their mother says, it's nice he can get to know her without all her troubles, meaning Father Gill. And she seems to have kind of a Don mentality about moving forward.
 
And Anita is more like Betty. She wants to see Peggy punished. She says she does whatever she feels like, you're too easy on her. And their mother changes the subject.
 
Steve: And I think what her mother says probably plants the idea in Anita's head that ends up showing up in the confession later of, yeah, Father Gill has no idea about what Peggy's been up to in the past, and perhaps if he knew about it, his attitude towards Peggy might change.
 
Jenna: I felt like this was really a callback to season one, when Peggy was complaining to Don that she follows the rules and other people, people who are not good, get to go around doing whatever they want.
 
And there she was referring to Pete and the people who stole the stuff out of her locker. And of course, it was representative for Don as doing whatever he wants.
 
And now here is Anita making the same observation about Peggy.
We see Peggy becoming more like Don and more like those Manhattan people.
I wonder, do you think the show is saying that basically selfishness is required for success?
 
Steve: I. I guess I don't get the vibe that there's any moral that they're trying to present here, but I do agree with you. The shoe is definitely on the other foot here.
 
And Peggy's objections to people doing as they please and shucking off responsibilities or obligations as they see fit. Or at least that others are trying to impose upon them. Clearly, she's got a different standard here. I feel for the Anita character. It just got to be very unsatisfying.
 
 
We cut to the next scene, and there's a flurry of activity as they're all getting ready to present to the American Airlines team.
We see everybody at their best. They've laid out all the displays. They're all dressed up.
 
Then we can tell as soon as Duck walks in the room that something's got terribly wrong. His contact over at American was fired, and thus, in effect, their whole inroad to American is shot.
 
But the American Airlines team is still coming to hear their presentation. The line here that Don says is that they still have to deliver a stillborn baby. That is to say, their presentation is going to be made with no shot of gaining the business.
 
Jenna: And this is such an iconic camera angle. We see Duck, who has been working so hard to engineer this American Airlines business across several episodes. And now he has to walk in and face just about every single character in the office and tell them his friend was fired and all their hopes are gone.
 
And when he opens the door, they're all arranged like a photo with Bert Cooper sitting in the center and everybody dressed up in their best. And it's just, ugh, what a moment.
 
And I also like this really super quick moment:
The gum-chewing secretary is back and she says the American Airlines people are here and Bert doesn't recognize her. So Duck was absolutely right about it. He did forget about firing her.
 
Steve: And they're all in shell-shock at that moment. The other thing I thought was notable here too, is the whole decision to chase American, you know, was Duck's idea. Through the connection to Shel, Roger and Burt were eager to do it and Don was the one who objected because it meant saying goodbye to the Mohawk business.
 
This collapse of the opportunity is no fault on Duck in any way. So it's not that they heard their thing and then rejected it. His in, their whole avenue has been chopped off here. So Duck is rather blameless from an account management standpoint. You know, just bad luck.
 
 
Jenna: In the next scene, we get another really interesting shot. Anita is going to confession with Father Gill. So we can see one side of the booth with this kind of lattice in between them for privacy.
 
She talks a little bit about some things that she's done that she wants to confess.
Then we also see her talking about Peggy and her resentment of her sister.
 
Steve: Yeah, and the vibe I get out of Anita's confession is really life isn't fair.
She's hung up with the unfairness of how Peggy has behaved and the fact that everybody is still trying to help her make excuses or allow her to go on as if nothing happened.
 
And here is Anita feeling like she's doing what she's supposed to do, obeying all the rules, and somehow she's not held up to be higher or better.
People aren't more interested in her than Peggy and. And she's miserable about it.
 
Jenna: I have some sympathy for Anita here. She says, what about me? What about my troubles? What about me being good?
She follows the rules and she has been told that this is enough. But very similar to Betty. I think she's got this emptiness.
 
And I also noticed that Peggy, who received the resentment from the secretaries who are waiting to eat the catering, she's no longer one of them and they expect her to wait her turn.
 
And she gets the same feelings from her sister because she took a turn away from her family expectations. She's doing something else.
 
Do you feel like this is selfish of Peggy to place the baby for adoption and keep working and living her life? Or do you feel like she should get respect for following her own path even though she gets this pushback?
 
Steve: Yeah, I guess I hesitate at the question because I think it presumes, you know, I'll judge that character's motives and ethics. And I don't know that I feel comfortable making that judgment here.
 
It's an interesting choice because I think you're right. Peggy clearly has prioritized her career and escaping this world that she comes from, this baby's inconvenient to those objectives. And thus her decision around her child is, like you say, not to raise it, not to let it hold her back.
 
Would that be a decision that I would personally make or that I think most people would make? I do think it's a realistic writing or portrayal of a character with those motivations. What about you?
 
Jenna: It's interesting how uncomfortable Anita is with it because I don't think she truly wants Peggy to be miserable and cast out of society. But she also feels like she should have to deal with some kind of punishment and disgrace, too.
 
It's interesting how mixed up her feelings are because as she says in her confession, he says, I know you love your sister. And she says, I do. And I. I believe her when she says this.
 
But this is such a revealing, personal scene. And we can look at Anita and be judgmental of her, but I think it's also very relatable that we look at this person in our life who's close to us, and we can see their flaws.
 
I want everybody else to see, you know, she's not so perfect, but if anybody were attacking her, she would feel also - I want everybody else to see she's also good. So she - you know, both things are true.
 
Steve: Yeah. And I think it. It reminds me of that saying that if you're. You're going to be jealous of someone, you have to be jealous of everything.
And I get a sense here that Anita is jealous of certain aspects of Peggy's life and world and choices, but also very judgmental and negative on others.
 
And I think that duality is crucial here because I suspect in Anita's own life she has concerns and pain points and dissatisfactions with the life she's been dealt and the choices she's made.
 
But by obsessing about how Peggy has escaped perhaps some of those aspects, the other half of it is all those prices that Peggy's going to play. Because I just have to imagine placing a child for adoption is not something anyone can do lightly and it's a decision that will haunt people for the rest of their lives and they're going to contemplate and second guess it and all the rest of it.
 
And you don't get the sense that Anita is sort of walking through all these implications of the choices Peggy's made making and she really is leaving a lot behind her in order to gain what's in front of her. But, but that's a cost and it's not always going to be favorable.
 
Jenna: Good points.
I also don't get the sense that Peggy and Anita have a lot of heart to heart talks. So I don't think that Peggy reveals to Anita how difficult her work life actually is.
 
And I don't know that Anita can really understand all of the things that Peggy's going through professionally, in addition to her adoption placement decision or that relationship with Pete. I don't think her family knows anything about that either.
 
So if she says something like she seduced a married man, which as we pointed out offline - no, she didn't. She didn't do that.
 
So I think there is a lot of fundamental misunderstanding and I'm sure that goes both ways, that Peggy also doesn't understand everything about Anita. But I think that's again very typical of siblings and adult siblings and how they focus on certain parts of their relationship. But they also miss huge pieces of, of pain and of strength and all the rest of it.
 
Steve: Yeah. And I think that's how we, we interact with people all the time. Right. We see and perhaps envy and long for some of the good things that we see that the others have.
 
But it's easy to discount or ignore the costs and the downsides. And when you look closely and see the totality, sometimes it can be very comforting to realize that you, you wouldn't want to make the trade offs they've made for these things that you do covet and that in fact, you know, you, you've made a better choice in your life even though the benefits and downsides are quite different.
 
Jenna: It does really remind you to think carefully before you're passing judgment on other people. Because we're so ready to do it. And we see Anita here and we can blame her for It. But it's more complicated than that.
 
Steve: We cut back to the conference room. In the aftermath of the failed meeting with American Airlines. Duck compliments the work that Don did, but it's pretty clear that Don is just fuming because this opportunity has dried up and blown away. And they got rid of Mohawk to get it.
 
And he slides the binder for the presentation towards Duck and says, you should have this. And it says Shel's name on it. Duck leaves, professional to the end, doesn't engage with Draper's sort of I told you so. He gets into a discussion with Roger, and they talk about the pursuit.
 
Jenna: And we were just talking about Anita's judgment of Peggy. And here Don is very happy to show no grace to Duck. The sliding the binder is everything. He's just full of blame and glad to blame Doug and not much of a team player, which we know to be true about him.
 
And Roger says, we were in it. That's the important thing. He's not casting blame on Duck.
 
And then he looks at Don and he talks about the chase. He says, your heart pounds, your knees go weak. Remember that? Old business is just old business.
And he talks about loving this chase of business.
 
I think we're also meant to understand. He's talking about what true love is and seeking that. And he says, do you remember that? I don't think Don is connected to Roger's needs here at all.
 
We know that they talk in code when they're talking about important things, but Don doesn't say anything. He's not ready for forgiveness. He's not ready to go on whatever journey Roger wants to go on. They're not having a connection here.
 
Steve: Yeah. In a way, you could even argue that Don Draper is pouting at this moment, you know, and feeling, you know, I told you so. I was right. We never should have gone down this with the benefit of hindsight.
 
It was a calculated risk, and the risk ended up stopping the opportunity here. But we always knew that was a possibility. It's an interesting moment for Don, and I guess I personally feel somewhat sympathetic to his frustration here. But he certainly isn't generous with Duck or anybody else about it.
 
Jenna: And most other shows wouldn't do that. They wouldn't have everybody come in over the weekend and give their all in their after hours to work so hard on a client and then have it matter of factly be taken away for a technicality.
 
Mad Men's realism: it'll break your heart, but it also is what keeps you coming back, because that these crises happen. And then the characters have to look at each other and figure out how they're going to deal with it.
 
And unfortunately, Don is not the kind of person who's going to be on your team in a kind way when things have gone wrong.
 
Steve: Yeah, he's not at his best at this moment for sure.
 
 
Jenna: Don comes home to dinner, and we see Bobby at the table messing around with a robot. He spills Sally's drink, and Betty says, Don, do something.
 
So he takes the robot, he throws it against the wall where it smashes. And he says, is that what you wanted?
And the family is stunned because this is not how Don normally is.
 
And we can also see this is Bobby's third break, even though really Don did the breaking here. But the bed was the sex life breaking.
The hi fi was the romance, and the robot is their future.
 
So all this brokenness and poor Bobby Draper has to represent the relationship crumbling between his parents.
 
And breaking the robot is not what Betty wanted. She follows him up the stairs, and they have it out. They finally have this conversation.
 
Steve: Yeah. And the. The writing here, I think, is really on point because it is that kind of fraught argument where the accusations are about the current situation, but really there's so much baggage tied up with what they're talking about.
 
Betty's frustrated that she's raising these kids, you know, struggling with them. She wants Don to come in and be this partner and ally and enforcer of what she's trying to instill in the children.
 
And she's just not feeling she's got a partner who's in the middle of it. And then even his reaction here goes to an opposite extreme of smashing the robot and freaking everybody out.
 
So. So that's a huge miss for her as well. And it's just, again, him not being the partner that she expects him to be.
 
Jenna: And her language is not great parenting. She says, I'm here all day alone with them, outnumbered, she says. And it's like it's a battle. It's her kids, right? So it's not very endearing.
 
“I'm here, and then you come home and get to be the hero.” And it's not a good look for Betty. But I do think anybody who has ever been a stay at home parent with young children can really relate to this kind of frustration.
 
But we also know that Don had a rough day at the office, so nobody's job is easy here. This fight escalates and they push each other, and then Betty walks away, and Don looks down and he's ashamed of himself, like, this is not who he wants to be.
 
Steve: Yeah, let's be clear. Betty pushes Don, and he instinctually and immediately shoves her back. And he's a lot bigger and stronger. He shoves her back significantly harder than she shoved him.
 
And it's a really masterful scene, and I think really well acted here by January Jones and Jon Hamm. We can instantly see on Don's face this combination of shame and
sadness when he realizes that he's allowed his anger to bubble out here and done something that you can tell he's sworn to himself he's not going to hit his children,
and he certainly doesn't want to be someone who hits his wife.
 
And now he's gotten in this physical engagement with her. And I think Betty, wisely, at that point of the reciprocal push, exits the space and just leaves Don with, I think, the failings of himself in that moment. Jon Hamm, I think, does a really great job in this scene of conveying that pain, hurt, disappointment.
 
Jenna: Don sits down on the bed, and Bobby comes in and apologizes.
And this very sweet, real conversation happens between them about Don's past. And he's honest with Bobby's questions.
 
We know Betty still has huge gaps in her understanding of Don's upbringing.
And Bobby's questions are really simple. What does your dad like to eat? What was his job?
 
And then he has this really sad moment, and he says, but your daddy died. And he says, yes, he did, a long time ago, you know, not wanting to put that on his son.
 
And then he says, we have to get you a new daddy. And they have the sweetest hug. And Don really seems to need this hug just as much as Bobby is. And you love him for being a present father in this moment, even though I think Betty is right to say he is not physically or emotionally present with them very often.
 
But in this moment, he's exactly what Bobby needs.
 
Steve: Yeah. And we've hammered the Don Draper character for not knowing what family is, not partaking in family, not valuing it. But in this moment, I really think we see Don Draper at his best. And I think we see a Don Draper who starts to appreciate what family means.
 
And at first, it's comforting his young son, who is so hurt and scared about what's just occurred. And Don takes the high road there and realizes he's got to provide some reassurance and let Bobby know that, you know, this is not the worst thing in the world.
 
But ultimately, I think it's Bobby's love for his father, that touches Don Draper's heart and he starts to see this is the magic of family. This. This is what makes family special and unlike anything else you're going to find.
 
And now his son is the one bolstering his spirits. It's a beautiful scene. It hits your heartstrings on all levels. At least it does for me.
 
Jenna: Let's take a moment and remember this quick exchange where Don says he liked to eat this candy with the purple and silver packaging, because that's going to come up later in the series and be significant, too.
 
 
Later that night, Betty turns out the light for bed. Don is still awake, and she confronts Don about their fight.
 
We have Don confessing something to her, something personal that's awful. And he had a very genuine moment with Bobby earlier. And so we get this conversation with Betty about something that's real, and they don't have it very often because when you finally see it, you realize how rare this actually is between them.
 
Steve: You know, Betty again is back to this corporal punishment. And Don says that his father beat the hell out of him and all it ever made him do was fantasize about murdering his father.
 
And then he says he wasn't half as good as Bobby was.
And it's so touching because we can see the hurt and damage that this childhood has caused to Don Draper. And I guess I would do a shout out to Betty's character in this moment because she's got all her emotions and frustrations and anger and hurt here, and yet she's just learned something profound about her partner.
 
And she moves into comfort mode and says, hey, that's not something I ever knew.
Goes to hug him and give him reassurance because she had no idea that she was treading into a ground that was so painful and fraught for her husband. So I think in my mind, this, this is Betty Draper, who's not had the best episode, I think, showing her best self here.
 
Jenna: It's such a simple line. She says, I didn't know that. But it's also so generous of her. As you say, she does have a lot of pent up feelings and she has a lot of things she wants of Don.
 
But even though Don is telling Betty, you're wrong, it brings them closer. It's a little closeness. He finally gave her an emotionally true piece of himself. It wasn't just sex. And I think kudos to her for registering that.
 
She puts her arm around them and they lie together and they're awake and they still have brokenness. It's not fixed, but they're together and she does try to comfort him.
And you're so relieved when some positive thing happens in their relationship. You just have to celebrate that.
 
Steve: Yeah. And again, going back to Betty's own comment about Don, he doesn't know what family is. This is what family is. This is a partner who's with you to deal with these demons from the past, with you to work through these frictions and tensions of the present.
 
It's such a lovely pro family wind-up to such an awful situation. Right. Because it's going completely off the rails. We're devastating a young boy, we've got the couple pushing each other. It's such a startling 180 in the course of a single scene, really.
 
 
The episode wraps up where we're at the church Easter Sunday. Children are doing their egg hunt in the church courtyard. Father Gill presents Peggy with an egg for the little one, he says, making it very clear that he is aware of her past.
 
Jenna: This exchange between Peggy and Father Gill seems really judgy. And I think that in religious terms it's meant to be. You know, Anita went to confession. She went to say, here's something that I did wrong and I expect you to judge me for it.
Maybe being judgy is not that off brand, but it's very different.
 
So Father Gill knows her big secret, just as Anita intended, and that is how he talks to her now. So. So there's no more, how are you? What do you think? Thanks for the speech tips, I enjoyed dinner last week. It's all different between them now.
 
And Peggy registers the difference, even though she doesn't know it's Anita who who revealed it.
 
As a viewer, even though I know better, I always wish Peggy could keep her baby and go to work and have it all. But this scene shows us why she keeps it private and why she moves forward.
 
There is already so much judgment around everything she does: how she dresses, how much she weighs, what men she talks to, if she eats with the writers instead of waiting with the secretaries. You know, if people knew this about her, it is all they would ever see.
 
And Anita mostly sees her escaping with this secret. Kind of like Pete seeing how Don has his secret. So as we see Peggy unmasked a little, as Pete unmasks Don for this thing she's working so hard to keep private about herself, we have sympathy for her.
 
We understand why she doesn't want this to be public. It isn't just selfishness. It's self protection. It's survival.
 
Steve: Yeah. I think there's clearly a change in the relationship.
Before, we were wondering just what sort of connection or warmth or possibilities were in the relationship.
 
It feels coming out of this scene that some boundaries have been drawn around the relationship, and maybe those boundaries conform to our ideals or expectations about what they should have been all along.
 
Jenna: This episode is the highest ranked for season two so far, and it gives us some interesting material, but like the previous episode, it's not as funny and I really miss that humor compared to some of the other episodes.
 
I mean, a lesser Mad Men episode is still great TV to me.
 
Steve: I would say that what I love about this episode is just the the intensity of the family scenes there at the very end of it. So to me, it finishes on such a powerful, touching, strong note. Yeah, I rank it pretty high for season two.
 
 
Jenna: Our closing song is some organ music, of course, wrapping up at the church scene on the third Sunday, J.S. Bach's Sleepers Awake.
 
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Steve: That's it for this episode of all things Mad Men, from Chip and Dip to Zou Bisou. Visit our website madmenctoz.com to vote for your favorite Sterling lines and to share your opinions on our Double Dip questions for each episode.
 
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Steve: Thanks for listening, everybody.