Mad Men C to Z Podcast Transcript for S5E5 Signal 30

This is the full podcast transcript for Mad Men C to Z, season five, episode five, Signal 30. The AI transcriptions provided by podcast distributors aren't reliable with character spelling, punctuation, and sometimes, even which speaker is talking, so we're providing a human-edited version here.
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Mad Men C to Z S5E5 Signal 30 Transcript
 
Jenna: Hi, I'm Jenna.
 
Steve: And I'm Steve. Welcome to All Things Mad Men, from Chip & Dip to Zou Bisou.
 
Jenna: There's so much to love about this amazing show, and we're happy to connect to fans like us, who discover new things with each rewatch.
 
Steve: Be advised, while we aren't gratuitous with spoilers, they can pop up as we discuss character arcs through the final season.
Let's get started with Mad Men C to Z.
 
Jenna: This is season 5, episode 5, Signal 30.
This episode was written by Frank Pierson and Matthew Weiner.
 
Frank Pierson wrote a number of notable films, including Cool Hand Luke, Dog Day Afternoon, and Presumed Innocent, and he co-wrote and directed A Star Is Born, the movie with Barbra Streisand.
 
This is also the third episode of Mad Men directed by John Slattery.
 
I've been a bit critical of the last two episodes overall, but I appreciate this one a lot. I think it's a great example of theming across an episode that works in service of the characters.

In the DVD commentary, Matthew Weiner says this episode is about friendship, and that surprised me at first because most attempted friendships in this episode don't really work.
I see it more about people longing to be something they're not.
 
If you amend it to say this episode is about people seeking friendship, I think that works better, and it really seems to shine a spotlight on loneliness and in spite of the tragedy.
I really like this episode a lot. How about you?
 
Steve: I think it's a good episode, and when I think about it in the context of friendships, I think a lot of that is also wrapped up within identities. You know, the identity of you as a professional, and then how that blurs into personal friendships.
And as you pointed out, you know, there's a lot of loneliness in this episode. I think there's also a lot of examples where there are expectations of what they thought the friendship represented, whether it was professional or personal or some combination of the two.
 
Jenna: This episode takes its name from a 1959 driver's education movie called Signal 30,
and it includes footage of real accident scenes, including deceased victims.
The second movie is called Mechanized Death, and there's a third one called Wheels of Tragedy.
 
Steve: I was fortunate, or unfortunate enough to see these films when I was in middle school,
and they are quite shocking even then. When I was in middle school they were fairly old,
but it's the actual footage from state patrols of highway accidents, and one of these sort of scare you straight intentions, I think, on the part of the paramechanics teacher.
 
And then when Pete chuckles in the scene, he's not being scared straight. He's just a guy who needs to learn how to drive. You know, his cynicism there in that moment, chuckling at something which is objectively pretty horrific.
 
Jenna: I also thought that was interesting. And there's kind of a sight gag because it opens in this driver's ed class and maybe you think it's going to be Sally in the driver's ed class.
And then as the camera pans past these young people, we see Pete.
 
But his response in the opening is so fascinating, because it opens with him laughing at this horror because it's so gruesome, and then it closes with him tearing up at his own tragedy.
So the bookends of this episode are very poetic.
 
 
During the Driver's Ed class, Pete's watching this young girl and it's creepy.
The actress playing Jenny is Amanda Bauer. You might recognize her from The Happys, Common Room, and Forev.
 
The transitions in this episode are so thoughtful, and for me, they go right up to the edge of being too noticeable, but they don't distract. For me, they work really well.
 
So here we have Pete eyeing the girl in Driver's Ed and he's watching her flip flop, tapping against her foot to the exact same rhythm of the dripping sink as we switch into the next scene.
 
 
Steve: And that faucet almost seems to be like a water torture on Pete's brain. We can see that he's got this malaise to him. He's ogling this young woman, and we see him at home next to his wife.
What does his life come down to? Listening to the faucet drip.
 
Jenna: Trudy is snuggled close to him and he asks her, does it go like that all day? And she answers, I suppose, but I don't hear it.
 
So it seems like Pete is getting something very ominous from this dripping, like his life is passing by and it's not working for him, whereas Trudy isn't bothered because she is fulfilled with his life.
 
I think this dripping sound, and it's combined with Roger's reference to Edgar Allan Poe later,
it seems like a nod to the Telltale Heart.
Of course, that's about a man who murders an old man because his eye offends him.
The murderer narrator is trying to convince the reader of his sanity, until the imagined sound of the man's heartbeat becomes too much to bear.
 
So a lot of that fits for Pete. He doesn't want his failings to be seen.
His frustrations are building.
And later he's going to attack an older man.
 
Steve: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Pete didn't attack anyone. He responded to a challenge.
 
Jenna: He tries to take agency about the sink. He goes under the sink and he stops the dripping sound.
He gets a faint smile, like he has some kind of control.
And it felt sad to me that this was such a win for him.
It was like, come on, Pete, dream bigger.
 
 
Steve: We move to the Pryces. Rebecca is eager to go and watch the World Cup Final, which took place on July 30, 1966, with England playing West Germany.
And Lane is not yet ready to go to the game, and isn't showing a lot of enthusiasm to attend it.
 
Jenna: I love this about Mad Men, because most shows don't give you this real life about how people act before they go somewhere and put on their public faces.
 
And we see Lane and Rebecca are still having this same core argument where she is in America but clinging to England.
She wants to meet with English friends, and Lane is resisting this.
He doesn't want much to do with English friends, or football, or any of the things he left behind, especially his father.
 
Steve: And I think this is the fundamental difference between the two of them.
Rebecca, to use Lane's words, wants to bring England over in pieces and cling to what she had.
And Lane is the reciprocal of this. He's really embracing his new American life, where soccer isn't something that really registers with anyone.
 
Jenna: I don't know how they reconcile the fact that they want such different things, but I want to point out that it feels like a very similar conflict to Pete and Trudy, because he really wants to be in New York City and she's very content in the suburbs.
So we see a lot of parallels between Pete and Lane this episode, and that's just one of them.
 
Steve: You spoke of the excellent cuts in this episode, and I think this next cut is perfect because we can see Lane and Rebecca jousting about the need to go there,
celebrating England's goals or victory with all the English fans who are at the pub.
 
Jenna: This might be the best transition in the episode from calm Lane placating Rebecca and promising to try to be pleasant, to him screaming his head off with his fellow Brits as England wins the World cup for the first time ever
 
Steve: And they're singing God Save the Queen, and celebrating the victory.
Lane may prefer his new life in America, but he has deep roots back in England,
and they're not something he can just shed or ignore, especially after a few pints.
 
 
Jenna: As Lane and Rebecca meet up with some friends, we see a new character, Edwin Baker.
He's played by David Hunt.
This actor has been married to Patricia Heaton of Everybody loves Raymond since 1990.
His acting projects include 24, Amazing Grace, and an episode of Homeland.
 
This is a place where it feels like Lane is looking for friendship. He's having fun.
The guy from Jaguar approaches him about working with his firm,
and like Peggy, it feels like Lane wants to try this personality on. I'm the guy who has British friends. It's my unique value proposition to the firm.
 
But there are cues already that it's not working. Because as much as Rebecca wants English friends, this English woman, the wife, reveals she wants to raise hogs. And there's nothing about that that's relatable to Rebecca or Lane.
And I think if it was an American woman saying that, Rebecca might scoff openly at it, but she's trying so hard to make this work.
 
 
Steve: Our next scene has Peggy eating alone at a diner when who should walk in but Ken Cosgrove.
 
Jenna: Ken avoids introducing them and doesn't invite Peggy to sit with them.
And you can see Peggy is curious about this meeting, because it isn't an upscale place, so Ken can't be meeting for a regular client lunch.
It's a short scene, but it sets up something that pays off really nicely later in the episode.
 
 
Steve: Another quick cut, and we're looking at Don Draper's sketchpad in a partners’ meeting where he's drawing a hangman's noose.
It's another meeting where Don is bored out of his tree. There doesn't appear to be any new business until Lane springs that Edwin Baker is interested in bringing Jaguar over to the firm.
 
Jenna: And as we're tracking Lane and Pete feeling slighted or ignored,
it's good to point out that Joan goes to every single partner except for Lane and asks about new business, and there isn't any.
So Lane seems especially pleased to be able to bring this business up.
 
And everybody else seems pleased, except Pete is mean about it, and he mocks Lane about his reticence to hire more people to serve as accounts. He takes this Southern accent and says, my lordy new business! We won't have any of that here.
 
Steve: I don't take it as mean, though, because I think it's a triumph for Lane that he's bringing new business in the door. And we know Pete is as hungry as anybody for the new business.
So it's the kind of joshing say that golfers would make at somebody who's hit a beautiful shot.
 
Jenna: Oh, really? I have a really different take on that.
I see Don correcting Pete and saying, it's a car and you know it.
And I think this is the beginning of what happens later when they have this conflict between them.
 
You know, Pete, who is so on guard against being emasculated or devalued,
is always ready to do that to somebody else.
 
Steve: We see Roger trying to glom onto the opportunity, and he offers to ride shotgun with Lane, since Lane is not an experienced account man. But Lane insists that it's his account, and he wants to take it.
 
Jenna: It's interesting how Lane wants to run this meeting and keep this connection to himself.
He's not an account guy,
so it feels like he's wanting to flex a little power and fix some things,
you know, like Pete trying to fix the sink.
But unfortunately, they don't have expertise in those areas, so it doesn't bode well.
 
 
Steve: After the meeting breaks up, Pete helpfully gives Don directions to their house in the burbs.
Don is feeling like he hasn't committed to going out to some party at Pete's house.
 
But Pete reassures him that when Trudy lets him know he needs to give directions to the place, that she's usually worked out all the details in these circumstances.
 
Jenna: Pete promises there will be no cards, no charades. And you can see he's trying to set up an evening that Don can tolerate so there won't be any dancing the Charleston, or Zou Bisou at this gathering.
 
When Don can't put Pete off about it, he tries to get Megan to call it off, and Megan won't.
And this is another reminder of how Megan is different from Betty.
Megan doesn't necessarily follow Don's commands, and Betty usually did. We saw Don always trying to get out of social things before.
 
Steve: Not only that, she refuses to do it and tells him he can call her himself if he wants to get out of it, which we'll see later, Don proceeds to do.
 
Jenna: There was a fan theory about suicide when this season was airing, because we saw a lot of violent references.
So at the beginning, Don is sketching the noose in the meeting.
And here Don says, Saturday night in the suburbs, that's when you really want to blow your brains out.
 
But I thought Don has had a lot of pretty lonely nights in Greenwich, so he doesn't really need to throw any shade at the suburbs.
 
Steve: It is kind of interesting because I think just Don in general doesn't tend to be the happiest guy much of the time. And I don't think it's really tied to the suburbs or his marriage or his relationships.
 
I agree with you. It's funny that he's so dismissive of life in the burbs when so recently it was very central to his very existence.
 
 
Jenna: Next up is a scene between Ken and Peggy, where Ken reveals he's still writing stories and he has a potential publishing deal.
 
When I first saw this scene and Ken and Peggy referred to the pact they have,
I thought I missed something in a prior episode. But this is the first mention.
So they agree if one of them goes someplace to a different business, the other one will go, too.
And this does finally feel like a genuine friendship, unlike some of the other attempts at friendship we've seen in this episode.
 
Although their relationship did start with Ken being pervy in the elevator. And there was that time they had the group lunch and he grabbed her and said something about zoo animals.
I'm glad they moved past that.
 
Steve: Well, and also, I think it's important to keep those in mind.
But as well, when Peggy started to show her creative chops,
Ken was very forthcoming with compliments and acknowledgement of her contribution and place.
Pete Campbell was quite the opposite and unwilling to acknowledge it.
 
Matthew Weiner, in his commentary for the episode, talks about Ken being a writer and that at some level there is a sense of Peggy seeing a threat potentially from Ken in that they're both writers.
I didn't get a vibe of a threat,
but it did seem to be another, deeper connection between the two of them that maybe goes above and beyond the traditional creative account relationship that we would typically see in the office.
 
Jenna: I agree. I don't get anything like that at all. And I think, in fact, it strengthens their friendship because Peggy, to me, does not seem threatened by Ken's writing. She seems impressed and she seems curious, and he trusts her to keep it a secret because she is his real friend.
 
And I thought this was a great detail when Ken says, I started turning most of my dinners into drinks, and if I only have one, I'm in pretty good shape when I get home.
So that's when he has time to do this.
So here is a guy who has a separate, full life away from work.
And that's so different from the other main characters.
Ken has his work life, his personal life and a creative life.
 
So his secret life, unlike Don's, is healthy and productive. He really doesn't need to get all his satisfaction from this job.
I think part of Peggy's curiosity is maybe about that part too, because she's so invested in her work,
but it's hard for her to imagine having a hobby like that.
But at this point, I really, really wish Lane would go find one. Like right now.
Go, go start gardening or something, Lane, it would be great for you.
 
Steve: I would also assume that this pact between Peggy and Ken arose after Ken joined the new firm. Because remember, he's left out when Lane fires the principals and they start the new company.
It's really straddling the fence between the professional and the personal here.
 
 
Jenna: Next, Roger goes to Lane to give him advice about his meeting with Jaguar.
Here we see Roger really does know how to do his job. He does have an art to his work.
Remember when Peggy said to Freddy, I can't believe that's his job?
Because Roger once told Don he could never get used to the fact that most of the time it looks like you're not doing anything.
But this scene shows us how Roger's work looks easy. It looks like he just goes out for drinks and dinner all the time.
 
But there's a craft to it, and Lane is trying to absorb the lesson. But Lane does not have the charm Roger has.
I mean, charm doesn't mean a lot when, like Mona, you've been married to him for a decade or you're his daughter and you want his attention.
But Roger really does have this gift and Lane doesn't seem to have it.
 
Steve: And it's interesting too, because Roger's approaching the advice from the standpoint of you're trying to create a professional relationship between yourself and the client and turn it into something more than a professional relationship by personalizing it.
And he talks specifically about sharing a conspiracy as the basis for this intimacy, and closer friendship that's going to be useful to you in retaining the client.
 
The irony is that Lane points out that he really does like Edwin and knows him personally. So he's almost starting at it from the opposite direction, where there is a personal relationship which he's now trying to extend into the professional space.
 
It's easier and it fits into Roger's model of how you build this thing. But we can just tell Lane is going to be clunky and not have an easy time of this.
Roger Sterling could take it in either direction and it's natural to him. It's easy.
 
Jenna: Roger drops a really funny line about how he once went on a five minute tear about “how my mother loved my father more than me. I assure you, that's impossible.”
 
So Roger didn't just inherit his father's company.
He was also his mother's favorite.
This spoiled guy never had to work or try any way the way Dick Whitman did,
and he has that in common with Pete and Betty.
 
But all three of them share that sense of emptiness with what they have. And that's so interesting. And that's a huge contrast with Joan and Peggy, too.
 
 
Steve: This next scene is one of my favorites. In the episode where Don Draper has taken it upon himself to call Trudy and get out of having to attend Pete's party.
I think the error that Don Draper makes here is it isn't Pete's party, it's Trudy's party.
 
And she is not going to take no for an answer. And she rather expertly deflects any attempt by Don Draper to remove himself from it.
 
Jenna: A lot of people defeat Don Draper in this show, but Trudy does it so smoothly.
This man who's good with the words, he has nothing left to say in the face of her insistence.
 
And even when he takes a shot at Pete and he goes, it's too bad your husband can't close a deal like this, Trudy corrects him and she goes, we both know he's doing just fine. 7:30.
 
That's it.
There's nothing more to say.
 
Steve: She basically hangs up on him, but in a perfectly polite way, shutting down the conversation. It is over. It is done.
And I love that after moment when the call has ended and Don Draper has a bit of a smirk on his face because he knows he's just been schooled on how to close a deal.
So it's a great scene and I think really shows the power of Trudy.
 
 
Jenna: So Pete is back at his driver's ed class and he's trying to chat with Jenny, who, let's point out, is a minor and over a decade younger than he is.
 
Steve: Pete's hitting on her.
It's completely inappropriate, both from a personal standpoint of, you know, we know Pete is married and has a young child,
and he can turn on his charms and he can leverage his Dyckman Campbell origins and talk about the Botanical gardens,
but it all just seems a little desperate and a little sad that this is who Pete is seeking to wow.
 
Simultaneously, we really understand that Pete is a true New Yorker. He never learned to drive. Now he lives in the burbs and is effectively stranded unless you know how to drive.
So he's trying to catch that up.
 
All in the midst of what we perceive, I think, as his dissatisfaction with his current life, despite all the outward signs of success. I mean, it really harkens back, I think, to the picture perfect life of Don Draper and his family when this series started.
And then we get to know how dissatisfied and empty Don's life is. It really feels to me like Pete is treading similar ground here.
 
Jenna: I see that, too. So, of course, this is lust and not friendship.
 
We're looking at the parallels between Lane and Pete in this episode. And Lane, I think, really is seeking friendship along with business and Edwin from Jaguar.
But as much as Pete is creepy, it's so lonely too,
because we've seen characters on Mad Men reach out to different people to try to affirm or understand themselves.
And that can be awkward or tragic or life changing,
but it is what people do. They try to connect and they kind of try to keep it hidden because you're not sure how it's going to go.
 
We see Don try to connect often for an ad campaign or to, you know, meet a woman.
And Pete usually does it to make himself feel powerful. And that is what is happening here.
And Jenny doesn't see Pete as anything more than a hallway conversation.
 
So the difference in their perception is so vast,
not just with their age difference, but just with how they're coming to this interaction.
So it's just like Dolores from Lane's found wallet.
And to these men, they're just these lifelines of possibility. And it's so lonely and so sad.
 
Steve: I will call out Vincent Kartheiser's acting in this scene where we just see all the different shades as he tries to turn on the charm and appear confident.
But there's also this undertone of self pity.
 
Steve: He tries to look magnanimous and generous.
We can also detect this lust he has for this young woman.
It's just masterful acting because he's conveying all this within the context of, I think, this rather modest scene during a break at the driver's ed class.
 
Jenna: They do make a reference to the sniper at UT Austin on August 1, 1966,
Charles Whitman killed his wife and mother before climbing to the tower observation deck and shooting at people.
He killed 15 and injured 31 others at the time. It was the worst mass shooting by a lone gunman in the United States.
If only that had been the last one.
 
Steve: It's really notable, I think, as the first mass shooting that got a lot of national attention. And when Whitman was up in the tower before he was eventually killed by a police officer,
there was footage of him continuing to shoot at targets around the tower.
 
And there were both civilians and police returning fire while he was there.
So I think, again, as we get into the television age and it really comes of age, you know, over the course of Mad Men in terms of society.
And this is setting the society and the culture onto a track of awareness of copycats.
And then, of course, many more shootings in the future of the United States.
 
 
Jenna: Next, we get a quick scene between Megan and Don as they're getting ready to go to Pete and Trudy's house.
And this feels like an echo of Rebecca convincing Lane to go out with friends, because Megan's doing the same thing for Don here. He's still trying to get out of it.
He says he's just going to drink as much as possible until he gets there.
 
And I just wonder, why is Don trying to avoid social gatherings in general? I get why he might want to avoid Pete specifically, but does he just think he's better than other people and he wants to avoid stupid conversations?
Or does he dislike having to be on good behavior or not being in control, as he generally could be if he was on a date?
 
Steve: That's an interesting question, because I don't think of Don Draper as antisocial,
but in many ways it almost seems like maybe his ability to interact with others,
maybe that is concealing a fundamental antisocial mentality that he has. He seems to enjoy his one on one with his various romantic interests,
and he seems to have a very nice rapport with his children,
you know, when he's interacting with them.
 
But he certainly doesn't seem to seek out social opportunities at all.
He doesn't seem to be one to build networks when he interacts with people like Conrad Hilton.
It's very mission focused and it's a means to an end, rather than him enjoying and luxuriating in the opportunity to talk to a big mover and shaker
 
 
Jenna: Over at Pete and Trudy's house, everything in the party dialogue from here on out is fair game for Ken for the closing story narration.
It starts with this comment Pete makes about his stereo.
He says,”We keep expecting to open the doors and see a tiny orchestra in there.”
And Ken says, “That would be amazing.”
And his imagination is already at work.
And Pete is not being poetic, he's just bragging.
 
So I love when Ken sees the fantasy possibilities of a tiny orchestra. And then when Pete goes, “It's seven feet long. Wilt Chamberlain could lie down in there.”
And Ken goes, “Why would he want to do that?”
Because tiny orchestra equals plausible. [Laughing]
But there's no character motivation for Wilt Chamberlain to lie down in the stereo. That's amazing.
 
 
Steve: When Don and Megan arrive, we can see how thrilled Pete is.
And I think If Pete ever has any hopes of building a professional and personal connection with Don Draper, this is the means by which he hopes to make that happen.
 
And it fits with his upbringing, where these sorts of social gatherings were very central to the social life of Pete, you know, the upper class to which we know Pete is very accustomed.
 
Jenna: Yes, Pete definitely feels like he's at work here,
and Don is in costume. They're doing the what people do thing as they greet each other. And there's this running gag about how Megan and Don forgot Ken's wife's name,
so Don greets her, Hello, you.
And I mean, it works.
 
This might seem like a tiny detail, but if this episode is about the emasculation of Pete Campbell,
this detail makes it so complete, because he accepts the William Greenberg brownies from Megan,
and he says, could we put them in the icebox? Could everyone try it my way?
 
I mean, I personally don't know why you would want to refrigerate a perfectly delicious pastry, but I think the idea that he wants to show off his thoughts and have everyone value them,
even the way they eat dessert, is so telling. It's perfect.
 
Steve: And it also shows what a perfect gift it is, because we know that Don Draper had no part in it. So that was Megan, who probably talked to Trudy and found out a treat from the city that Pete would really value in his new life in suburbia, and maybe something that he doesn't get to have as much as he used to.
 
Jenna: I also really like that Ken and Pete are open about the extensive planning that went into this evening just for Don.
They say there's no work talk, no baby talk, and Don gets the big steak.
 
And it's funny to me that they reveal this to him. And it's so real, because I feel like we often pretend it's very natural to just show up and socialize.
And in fact, there's a lot orchestrated behind the scenes, including reminders to avoid certain topics around particular people.
And yet we pretend like everything is so effortless.
 
 
Next, Lane is on his Saturday night meeting with Edwin Baker from Jaguar.
Lane thinks he's pulling strings, as Roger advised him to. And Lane also thinks they're becoming friends.
But this man wants to talk about the tomatoes and gardening,
and they had very different experiences in the war,
and they really just don't have much in common outside the fact that they're both in New York after having lived in England.
 
Steve: And when Lane tries to get him to confide in something, some source of discomfort or unhappiness in his life. Edwin has a comedic moment when he just expresses that his life is grand and everything's going great.
 
So Lane can't leverage that angle and, you know, is left going with plan B as Roger laid it out, which is where Lane needs to express some weakness or foible so that the conspiracy can be planted and grow between the two of them.
 
Jenna: Yes, Lane really wanted to be the hero and bring in this account on his own, and it's turning out to be a little more difficult than he expected.
 
 
Back at Pete and Trudy's, they're discussing how their suburb Cos Cob got its name. And all of this shows up later in Ken's story.
An English family named Coe came to settle the area. Coe shows up as the main character in the story, and Pete makes a joke about Cos Cob sounding like the Algonquin word for briefcase.
And Algonquin is the new pen name Ken will choose.
 
The conversation turns to where everybody else lives, and there's this level of honesty in everybody, including Don, that is surprising.
Cynthia admits that help from her parents comes with strings, unlike Trudy's, she says.
and I love that detail because it feels very true that it would in a lot of families.
 
And Ken talks about growing up in Vermont,
and Don talks about going to an outhouse in winter,
and that is a shockingly personal thing for him to reveal, I think, especially if we look back at episode two, he had dinner with Roger and Mona, and he avoided sharing any background details about himself. He said, think of me as Moses in a basket.
 
Steve: I got the sense of it was almost like a sequence of one upmanship,
you know, the talk of parks and greenery there in the suburbs versus the city,
which then Ken one ups with, I grew up in Vermont, and that's the real country.
 
And then Don Draper seems to one up Ken with not just the beauty of rural America,
but, you know, the misery or suffering and poverty of rural America.
And it's all done in good spirits and with smiles on their faces.
But it does feel like there's a bit of a joust going on here, as well as to know who's the most country.
 
Jenna: They go on to discuss the sniper shootings. And there's that moment where Cynthia says Charles Whitmore, and Don corrects her, Whitman.
And Megan shoots him a look.
My first time through, I missed that. I was just thinking it was Don being prickly, like Connie might say. And, of course, Whitman is Don's birth name.
 
Steve: Cynthia brings up Ken's writing. Even though Ken tries to change the subject, the conversation turns to it.
And Cynthia's obviously very proud to brag about her husband's writing. And I think we can see some genuine respect around the table for the fact that Ken has this other profession that's taking place in parallel to his work with the firm and in advertising.
 
Jenna: Yes. When Cynthia tells the story, she summarizes it,
that a robot pulls a bolt out of a bridge, and all the humans who commute on it between the planets die.
And it's really upsetting, much like the shooting that they were discussing before.
 
And in spite of that, Don can't help himself from being curious. And he asks, why does he do it?
And I wonder, do you think Ken's story is fundamentally about his own feelings of feeling like everybody's telling us what to do?
 
Or is this observation about Pete and Lane, or just sort of a general sense that everybody has somebody telling them what to do, and all you can decide is whether to fix the bolt or remove it?
 
Steve: I guess from my perspective,
I think Don Draper has had to face the question, why? Why do this? Or why not do this?
So I think that's just where his interest lies at this point,
the why behind why people do things, where they come from.
And in this case, it's not the most satisfying answer, you know, from Ken about the robot.
And it really doesn't feel like it is an answer, you know, there almost is no why for the robot doing it.
 
Jenna: Well, my question is,
is Ken observing this about himself as he writes the story, or about Don, or about Pete or Lane or somebody, or it - does he believe this is a general condition?
 
Because I was trying to figure out this idea of feeling helpless, of course, and feeling like the only choice you have is to do something really destructive, because everything else you do is already prescribed, and how depressing that is, and how we've seen so many of our characters feel that way at different points.
It's an interesting thing for Ken, because generally we see him being so optimistic. So for him to make this very dark observation, I wondered where that was coming from.
 
We get a quick truth call-out in this conversation as Trudy asks me about acting and copywriting.
I kind of got the sense that Megan might be more open or detailed on this subject if Don weren't there.
 
Steve: It does seem like Megan's a little uncomfortable with that conversation, in a similar way to Ken.
 
 
Jenna: Suddenly there's water spraying all over the kitchen,
and the men rush in. Pete fumbles with his toolbox, but Don takes off his sport coat, goes under the sink, and takes care of it.
 
Steve: And we've seen this before in situations, you know, where there's stress or people struggle to know what to do.
And Don Draper knows exactly what to do here. And I imagine this probably goes back to his Dick Whitman days.
 
He covers up the leak with a pot.
He turns off the water so there's no longer a leak. He quickly diagnoses the water valve was turned on too much to create excessive pressure.
All of which is knowledge and competence that Pete Campbell lacks in his suburban home.
 
And we can see, you know, when he takes off his dress shirt, you know, it's handsome Don Draper. And all the ladies notice. So you've got this handsome man competently dealing with a household issue. And clearly, they're very much impressed by Don Draper.
 
We know that Pete, in his insecurity and jealousy, has got to be measuring himself against Don in this moment, and he can't be happy about it.
 
Jenna: Pete can't even decide which tool to grab.
 
Yeah, I felt like it was a little excessive how Don was treated so much like Superman for this, but I accept that if Jon Hamm is in your kitchen and he takes his sport coat off, that you know, that's going to attract some attention.
 
 
There's a moment when Trudy comes in with a baby,
and everybody in the room smiles and seems to have a minute of very genuine sweetness about it.
But I wasn't totally sure what Pete means with his line here.
He says, I take no credit for her at all.
 
So I don't know if he's just trying to attribute credit to Trudy,
because everybody else in the room, even Don, who's not terribly sentimental,
they all seem really taken with the sweetness of this little person.
 
Steve: I just thought it was in response to how physically cute the baby is. So giving credit to the mother, you know, it would be untoward for a Dyckman Campbell to try and shine any light on his half of the DNA.
 
 
Jenna: Next, Megan is driving back to the city, and Don tells her to pull over so they can make a baby.
Megan deflects, and she doubts he means it, but she does think Don looked hot fixing the sink, so . . .
 
Steve: Well, they end up pulling over, right? So I don't think they even get home. It's funny how she calls out Don Draper and says, you know, this domestic situation is what gets you going?
 
Because Don, of course, had to be dragged kicking and screaming out to the suburbs for this little get together.
But I think, again, it's another indication of just how into Megan Don is, and just the idea that he is even contemplating having some more children.
It's interesting because I never got the sense that he had a lot of enthusiasm for his three prior children.
 
Jenna: I agree. And I thought it was interesting to finally really get Megan's take.
I don't think she's averse necessarily, but it's also not something that she's rushing right out to do.
 
 
Later, Roger and Pete stop by Lane's office to ask how his meeting with Jaguar went.
And Lane has to confess the plan didn't work. But he has another dinner scheduled.
And Pete bulldozes over this completely. He says, Roger, Pete, and Don will take it from here.
Roger's a little more gentle. He says, we need you to stay a pure friend.
 
Steve: It's clear when they step outside the office who's in charge,
as Pete makes it very clear that the inclusion of Roger is inviting him to the dinner, not the wedding night.
Again, we just see this emasculation of Roger, and his lack of a real role or power in the firm.
It's Pete's show. It's Pete's call.
Pete will be as kind or rude to Lane as he chooses to be.
And Roger gets the same rough treatment. And Pete leaves no room for doubt about it.
 
Jenna: And Pete shows so much contempt for Lane afterward when he says he couldn't close a car door.
That also might be a little bit of foreshadowing the season.
 
And Pete's right about how to proceed with Jaguar. So why do we hate him so much for it? I mean,
he's right. Lane shouldn't be left to do that by himself.
 
Steve: It's also interesting because we know Pete is the well raised, well mannered WASP here. He's acting with no grace, very little in the way of manners. I think it's just unlikable Pete being unlikable Pete here.
He emphasizes his power and control when it doesn't need to be emphasized.
He runs over people who don't need to be run over if he thinks this is what's going to make him feel better about himself and his life. I think we know as viewers he's, he's mistaken.
 
 
Jenna: So Pete is back in driver's ed and he's trying to flirt with Jenny.
He ignores all sense. And he tells her she promised to go to the botanical gardens with him, which she didn't.
And before Jenny has to reject Pete outright, in walks Mr. Handsome.
 
He's taller than Pete, more confident.
He has to watch Jenny and see what she's really like when she's interested in a guy, because she has never been like this with Pete.
 
Steve: He's in a complete other league from Pete.
And the other quality you didn't mention is he's a heck of a lot younger than Pete and she has eyes only for Hansen. Pete is left gnawing on his own jealousy and insecurity.
 
Jenna: Yes, Lane and Pete have very similar discontent, even though they have unlikely parallels. And this is certainly one of them.
Jim Hansen is played by Parker Young. He's been in Imposters, Arrow, and Suburgatory.
Again, if Pete getting friend-zoned counts as this episode being about friendship,
this is another case of somebody attempting a relationship that did not work out as they hoped.
 
Steve: Well, and let's also point out Pete isn't offering true friendship. You know, he's a user and he's trying to get what he wants with no thought of what the other person wants.
 
And that certainly isn't fitting my definition of friendship. Although I'm sure if confronted, Pete would hide behind the notion of, oh, I was just trying to be friendly and kind and whatever.
And it's like that had nothing to do with it, Pete.
 
Jenna: That's a fair point. It's very much the way Don seeks escape or sought escape in the first seasons of the show. It wasn't really about concern for the other person.
It was just his own interest.
 
 
Steve: And speaking of popping the bubble of apparent friendship,
the next scene takes us to the dinner with Edwin, Don, Roger and Pete.
And Edwin makes it perfectly clear up front.
They don't need to wine and dine him. They're going to get his business.
What he's actually looking for is a little bit of fun in New York City.
 
So he doesn't want to go to a hotel bar. He wants to go somewhere more discreet so he can have his fun.
And of course, these experienced account men understand immediately what Edwin's talking about.
This isn't about friendship.
This is about Edwin leveraging the account to get something that he wants. And that seems to be a little escape from his marriage for the evening.
 
Jenna: Of course, Roger knows a place.
 
If you look very closely in the next scene, you can see Edwin pairing off with a gum chewing girl before they disappear. Put a pin in that.
 
Roger goes off, then Pete, and Don gives Pete a judgy look and Pete registers that.
But Don just stays at the bar.
 
Steve: Edwin looks tickled pink and is thrilled to be here. This is his idea.
And Roger seems to be doing what Roger does.
So he seems perfectly content to go off with his woman.
 
And Pete almost seems a little passive. So the woman who goes off with Pete, she creates the excuse that they have to go back to her room to find the rum.
And Pete is willing to be led there by her,
but it feels like she's driving the car here with a client who's not entirely enthusiastic.
 
Of those gentlemen, the one who doesn't go off with anyone is our super stud of the series, Don Draper.
And I think this is an indication of Don Draper trying to be good here. He's married. He wants to be loyal to Megan.
 
This isn't the kind of behavior that would be tolerated, and it's exactly the kind of behavior that ended up helping to blow up his marriage with Betty.
So, of all people, Don Draper is the one who stays at the bar drinking.
 
Jenna: Daphne, who goes off with Pete, is played by Cherilyn Wilson.
She's been in Greetings From Home, Love Vampires, and True Blood.
 
If you had to pick one scene to define Pete Campbell, this might be it.
He has the world at his fingertips. He has so much. He has so many options.
And here he is paying somebody to love him for a few minutes.
 
And his fantasy is not about affection, because remember when Roger wanted to take the call girl to dinner and have some conversation?
Pete's fantasy is all about power.
 
Steve: Well, and he also seems to be a little pouty and mopey once they get into the room.
When he starts to get too physical with her too quickly,
she pushes him off a bit and says, look, you know, we're not doing this by the minute, so we don't need to rush this.
 
He almost seems whiny in terms of, well, do you even know what you're doing, you know, or how good are you at your job?
Which seems an odd mentality to bring into the room. And obviously, she's a professional, so she starts to go through her menu of offerings.
 
He shakes his head and refuses them. But even when they get to the one that he's going to go with,
you're my king, I don't get the sense of a lot of energy or enthusiasm here.
 
It's almost in some ways, like, well,
in my mopey emotional state here, this is the least problematic, so let's go with that.
But it's kind of an interesting state of mind that Pete's in. I don't get the sense he's having a great time here.
 
Jenna: I think this scene is so perfectly Pete. He can have whatever it is he wants, and he's still determined to be unhappy with it.
 
Steve: Pete wants what he doesn't have.
So I think your point is well taken.
He has so much again, he's ticking all the boxes in a very similar way to Don Draper.
 
Most people looking at him in his life would say, wow, you've got everything, Pete. What are you lacking?
That's his focus. The glass is only 9/10 full for Pete Campbell,
and he needs the other 10th, and he's always going to need it.
 
And then we've got Don Draper, I guess, is the other end of the spectrum, who is not engaging in this, even though he's with company, all of which is doing it so there would be no judgment or, you know, isolation of him for making that choice.
No one else is going to know, but Don's choosing to be good tonight.
 
 
Jenna: Back in the common room, a madam approaches Don.
Her name is Giselle. She's played by Eve Gordon.
She's had a long career going back to the Cosby Show and the World According to Garp,
as well as the Powers that Be, and Felicity. She's also another Masters of Sex and Mad Men crossover actor.
 
So first she establishes that Don isn't a cop.
And again, Don, of course, is more open with a stranger than with a colleague or a friend.
And he reveals,
I grew up in a place like this,
and we know he grew up on a farm. So at this point in the series,
it feels like that could be a lie.
But later we'll learn that's true.
 
Steve: And again, he's so good with the words. So when she shoots back in response, you know, not as nice as - not as fancy as this, he quickly concedes the point.
 
It was a whorehouse and not as upscale as this particular one, which seems to be the right answer. And I think as a madame who would be very good at reading people,
I think she can see the truth in what Don's saying. You know, Dick Whitman must have grown up in a whorehouse.
 
 
Jenna: In the cab on the way home, Pete really pokes at Don about the hypocrisy of his judgment.
And Don doesn't say anything. He's trying not to engage on the subject.
And when Pete says, you, you of all people,
and Don says, you're right, and he looks away and he's trying to say goodnight.
 
So I feel like Don has the judgment, and I feel like Pete is right,
that it's hypocritical.
But Don isn't trying to say anything here. He doesn't want to have a showdown.
He's not trying to lecture Pete. But Pete really draws it out of him.
 
Steve: Yeah, and I like that about the writing here, because I think that's the key. Pete has correctly detected a judgment here, a negative judgment from Don Draper. And we know that Pete Campbell is attuned to that.
He wants to impress Don.
He wants to be friends with Don. He wants him to have a good relationship.
 
And now he feels negatively judged for something which, irony of ironies, Pete Campbell knows Don Draper has engaged in to the nth degree.
I can sympathize with Pete's frustration here of you of all people. Boy, this is rich.
And Pete tries to hide behind, he was just doing his job.
And then he has to take a shot at Don. And he says, “to a man who just pulled his pants up on the world.”
 
Jenna: it's shocking how much Don's disapproval bothers Pete.
And he just keeps going until Don finally says,
“You don't get another chance at what you have.”
And that's important for the end of the episode. So hold on to that thought.
 
Steve: Pete really has to squeeze it out of Don because at multiple points, he's trying to smooth it over and just change the subject and let things blow over.
But it's Pete who's sunk his teeth into this.
And basically he wants to hear what is your judgment? And, you know, and Pete is anticipating what it is, but he wants Don Draper to say it.
 
Jenna: I was surprised at Don's view of Megan when he says, if I had met her first, I would have known not to throw it away.
Really?
Betty was just so unhappy and miserable, and it was her fault the marriage didn't work?
I mean, what? We saw Betty in the first season doing everything she thought Don wanted.
 
People love who they love. And maybe the depth of Don's feelings for Megan is just a lot deeper than it ever was for Betty. So maybe she was just a stand in for what he thought he was supposed to want.
 
But even here, I have trouble believing Megan is the love of his life. It feels like Don is convincing himself that now he's going to be that happy in love person.
And I think Pete cheating on Trudy reminds Don how easy it is to go down that path.
So even though Don likes Trudy, I think it's more about his fear than his judgment of Pete.
 
Steve: I agree with you. Don Draper is lying to himself,
and it's manifested in this lie to Pete.
 
But I think if you look at what's the alternative for Don Draper,
if I had met Megan first, I would have blown up that relationship just like I did with Betty.
What a horrible thing to conclude and to believe about yourself.
 
So I think he's almost forced, from a survival perspective to latch onto the alternative and to personalize it, to say, oh, if I had met her first, I would have known not to throw it away.
Yeah, I'll take those odds all day, Don Draper, and I think I'll win that wager. But I get why he has to go there.
 
And it's also interesting, his assessment of Roger as well, because when Pete is asking him, you know,
no stern looks for Roger,
and Don seems to have put Roger into the prior Don Draper box of, Roger is miserable.
I didn't think you were.
 
And at this point, when he says that, that's when Don turns to look at Pete directly.
And Pete's response is interesting.
He's kind of defensive, and he says, I have it all.
Wait until your honeymoon is over.
And those seem to contradict each other.
 
I have it all.
Oh, but I'm unhappy. So wait until your honeymoon is over, and you'll see how you can be unhappy with having it all.
It's a perfect oxymoron.
And I think Don Draper knows all too well what Pete Campbell is expressing there, that feeling. And I think that's part of what grates on Don Draper. He knows that he has walked in Pete Campbell's shoes, and his judgment of Pete is really a judgment of himself.
 
 
Jenna: Next, we see Roger calling Ken in to let him know he needs to stop writing in the evenings.
Do you think it's Roger's jealousy about Ken's writing that makes him tell Ken to stop? Or is this legitimate professional concern about his account man?
 
Steve: that's an interesting question. In his commentary, Matthew Weiner says that he thinks it's probably Pete who rats out Ken to Roger.
 
And we know Roger's in a world where he doesn't really have a job or any responsibilities.
So I suspect that's what triggers Roger to want to have this conversation with Ken.
Roger wants to enforce the old values and be that representative of that standard and expectation in the midst of a world where everything else that Roger thought was a standard and an expectation is being swept away and the rug's being pulled out from under his feet continuously.
 
It's ironic that Roger says when the job is good, it satisfies your every need, because we know just how much this job isn't satisfying Roger's every need.
And yet here he is trying to box in Ken on something that would be very similar. You know, I would argue Ken would say the job doesn't fulfill his every need, and that's why he needs a creative outlet separate from it.
 
Jenna: I agree. I found that line really sad, especially because he follows it with, “Believe me, I remember.”
So there was a time when he felt like the job filled every need.
 
But right now, Roger is right back to pacing and he's on empty. There's no emotional fulfillment there.
 
And all of our big six characters wrestle with how large the job looms in their lives.
We see that with Don and Peggy, Pete, Joan, Roger, also Lane, and Betty doesn't have a professional option outside the home, and she's miserable and seeking some other thing. So we really see this conflict.
 
And here's Ken.
This is the perfect example of somebody having something you don't.
Ken is a successful writer. He didn't have to self publish a memoir the way Roger did. Roger's trying to pretend like being an account man is the height of excitement and success.
And he's not fooling himself on this point,
in spite of how spoiled he is.
 
Just like with Pete being spoiled and selfish,
it's a little bit tragic that he's gotten to this place and what does he have to show for it?
 
Steve: Well, and also this pettiness of squishing Ken's dream,
because objectively,
if Ken isn't ratted out by his wife at the meeting,
none of them would know. So what is this claimed harm or distraction or diversion?
If there's no tangible impact,
there's nothing they can point at.
 
So now Roger is just stepping on him for the sake of stepping on him. And like you point out, I think it's really a product of his own unhappiness.
 
Jenna: There's an interesting meta fan theory about the whole show being Ken Cosgrove's epic novel, and I don't think that holds up to a lot of scrutiny, but it's a little bit delightful to imagine.
 
 
Steve: We have a quick scene after this where Lane is rushing to the partners’ meeting and a call comes in from his wife, Rebecca.
She's upset. It seems urgent.
So even though he's going to be late for the partners meeting, Lane has to take this call from his wife at the partners’ meeting.
 
When Lane comes in and he's clearly upset,
Edwin has cancelled the arrangement to move his account to the firm.
And it seems that this has stemmed from an incident that his wife has become aware of the prior evening.
 
Jenna: “Why would he say anything?”
 
Steve: I love Jared Harris's delivery of the line,
“Edwin had chewing gum on his pubis!”
It's so perfect the way he delivers it.
 
And then we see Roger, Pete,
and Don break out loud laughing. And only Bert sits there, looking serious because he realizes this account has just been lost.
 
Lane is beside himself, accuses them of corrupting his friend.
And I think this is what gets Pete back up here. When we see the naivety of Lane talking about his pure friend who was corrupted.
And now Pete is going to rather brutally educate Lane about what went on.
 
Jenna: Pete's terrible.
And I think he's enjoying laughing with Roger and Don and feeling like one of the boys here.
And he's pushing Lane, like, oh, you're on the outside. You don't get it.
 
So he offers, Edwin didn't ask you to go out because he thought you were a homo.
And everybody in the room, there's a look.
Everybody is like, too far, too far.
 
And that is a blow to Lane.
But a few beats later, when Pete says,
“Our need for you disappeared the minute after you fired us.”
To not be needed by the people you work most closely with,
and to hear that in front of the other partners, just a dagger to the heart.
 
I get why that breaks Lane. He's just like, he's not having any more of it. Pete went too far. And every indication was that he would continue to keep saying it.
He has no shame. He has no regret. He has no - it doesn't just come out of his mouth and then he's instantly sorry.
It's just him spewing.
 
Steve: Yeah. He shows so much contempt to Lane here,
which also flies in the face of their own relationship,
where it seemed that there were many occasions where Lane was advocating and respectful of Pete's place and the need for Pete in the firm.
And now we have Pete just cutting all those lines.
 
There's no need to be so brutally rude and crushing to Lane in this moment.
It's interesting because we've watched Lane get knocked to the ground by his father and not offer up any resistance.
But in this moment,
Lane's honor has finally been affronted to the point where he starts to prepare for fisticuffs with Pete.
 
 
Jenna: There is a lot to love about this fight scene between Lane and Pete,
but my favorite line, it's probably top five across the series.
All right, I think I have said that about at least eight lines so far, so clearly I'm really terrible at counting. But it's not my fault because there's so many great lines!
 
I absolutely love it when Roger goes,
“I know cooler head should prevail, but am I the only one who wants to see this?”
 
Steve: And I like how Don helpfully starts closing the curtain on the conference room so nobody else will see these two grown men starting to have a fist fight.
 
Jenna: I'm pretty sure Roger is not the only person who wants to see this fight either. I think Joan’s right later. Everybody wants to see Pete take a hit.
 
Steve: Pete is incredulous at this challenge as well, and I think we can see him sort of questioning, is this real? Like, do you really mean this? Or, you know, is it just it's a figurative statement you've made.
 
And as Lane prepares for the fight and starts rolling up his shirt sleeves,
it's pretty clear, no, he wants to physically engage with Pete. And of course, Pete has to respond. You know, it's a matter of honor at this point.
So it's happening.
 
Jenna: So as a human, I hate this fight for them. I feel like it's tragic for both Lane and Pete. It's terrible HR practice, but as part of the show, I mean, yes, please bring this.
 
And I like that Pete and Lane aren't the strongest guys in the room to begin with,
and they both have these obsequious tendencies.
I remember, you know, Lane saying, yes, sir to St. John over and over.
So we don't view them as these super aggressive, prone to fighting types.
 
And they both look a little bit unsure about how to proceed, but, like, they're in it now and they can't stop. So now we're going to have a show.
 
Steve: And you really wonder what's going to happen here. You know, Lane is probably close to 20 years older than Pete, but Lane is full of fire. He's been insulted, and he's going to seek redress.
There's not a lot to the fight. We see a few punches back and forth.
 
I will note that Pete punches first and initiates the actual fisticuffs, and then from there, they go back and forth.
Joan is eavesdropping and hearing the fight.
And the line I love from that is Pete saying to Lane, “You want some more, Mr. Toad?”
Which is just a great insult, especially because as we cut back to the fight,
we see a nice combo from Lane that puts Pete down and ends the fight.
 
Jenna: This scene also reminds me of the fight in the Suitcase between Duck and Don.
There's no hero in either fight, and the instigator loses in both fights.
Neither fight ends in a glorious victory. They're disheveled and bruised,
and nobody looks at it and admires what they stand for.
 
Steve: I like Lane's line to Pete as he's laying on the ground, not rising, and he says, consider that my last piece of advice.
And he departs while Roger and Don come over to get Pete back on his feet.
 
And I think Pete looks a little lost at that point. And I think he realizes at least Lane could argue he was fighting for his honor.
What was Pete fighting for?
The right to abuse and belittle Lane?
 
And it seems fitting that he lost the fight.
And I like that little lie from Don Draper. You'll be fine.
 
Jenna: Yeah. Pete won't take Don's hand to help him up because he's mad Roger and especially Don didn't take his side.
So they're not friends.
 
And I think when he was laughing with them, he felt like he was part of the in group, and it showed that, in fact, they were not.
 
But it's hard to be on Pete's side when he's like that. I think we're remiss - we need to talk about the fact that Lane called Pete a grimy little pimp. We need to make note of that.
 
And there was also the line Lane has. He says, I can't believe the hours I have put into becoming the monster you've become.
And it's just - we questioned whether this relationship between Lane and Pete was authentic.
And the idea. We heard that from Bert about Don earlier,
too. Just this idea that you grew this thing and allowed it to fester, and instead of something productive, it's something hateful and dark.
 
Steve: Well, and I think it fits in with the friendship theme of the episode,
because these words are truly hurtful. To who? To your friends.
Because you're now saying the meanest, cruelest things you can say to someone.
 
And it's probably some element of hyperbole at this point when people are so upset and emotions are so high, but it's burning down. Whatever illusion of friendship remained in that moment of intensity and cruelty,
and it's just so tragic and ironic that it's only with friends you could do that. Your enemies know you already feel that way, so it doesn't need to be said.
 
And it's not a shock to hear it when it's between people where there were assumptions or at least relying upon assumptions,
they're really burning the bridges down, and it gives it an element of tragedy and pain. I think that,
ironically, can only come when it's friends doing it to each other.
 
Jenna: And Roger has a really great line at the end where he goes, “I don't know about you, two, but I had Lane.
 
But that does remind me of something you said offline about how if Pete had won and Lane had lost,
how extra sad that would have been.
 
Steve: Yeah, I would - it would have been horrific, wouldn't it? You've been verbally abused and belittled and then the bully, the verbal bully now puts the boots to you physically.
It would have been such an awful outcome.
 
Given our apathy towards Pete Campbell at the best of times,
there's a certain vindication here with Lane's physical victory over Pete.
 
 
Jenna: We try so hard not to talk about the episodes between our rewatch and the recording, but this episode was so good that we kind of couldn't help a little bit of discussion offline.
 
Steve: It's on my other podcast.
 
Jenna: Oh, you're hateful.
 
I also did just want to point out this great non verbal moment. Elisabeth Moss does this so well.
She walks in like, hey, what happened to this room?
 
And then her whole face is like, you know, maybe I need to come in. And then it's very clear like, nope, nope.
And she just turns and leaves. It's really perfect.
 
Steve: It is so perfect and delicious. Every time I rewatch that scene, I stick around for that moment.
 
 
Jenna: In the next scene, Joan has the chance to reciprocate the kind thing Lane did for her recently when she was worried she was being replaced at the office.
She goes into Lane's office, brings a bucket of ice for his hand.
She tells him he's essential and she's a real friend to him,
and he misreads it.
 
Steve: I love the acting after or during Lane's uninvited kiss of her,
and then afterwards as she stands and opens the door and sort of straightens herself, but returns to his side to continue to be a friend and to support him in this hard moment.
It's just so perfectly done.
 
And we just feel so bad in that moment for Lane, because we know he's going to feel bad and humiliated for having misread her attentions.
 
But at the same time, I think we have sympathy for Joan, that, you know, she shouldn't be subjected to that. And that's completely inappropriate on Lane's part. Although I feel as a viewer, I can cut Lane some slack because I know just how low he is.
And probably now coming down off the adrenaline of pummeling Pete Campbell's face.
 
Jenna: And remember,
Joan just kicked Greg out of her life.
She's a single mom. She's living with her baby and her mother,
and none of that shows at work.
 
So she still extends this kindness to Lane. She brushes past the awkwardness of the kiss,
and she makes him smile when she goes,
“Everybody in this office has wanted to punch Pete Campbell,” which, true.
 
And Lane really needs Joan in this moment. And she sees the ugly bits and she's still there for him. And I really admire her for that, because she hasn't always been that kind of a friend to Peggy.
But she's here for Lane.
 
Steve: And I think back to the friendship theme.
This is true friendship. Even when the friend crosses a line,
Joan knows that Lane needs some support now. And she's not going to personalize this and turn it into something about her.
 
She's going to stand in there for Lane. And I think it speaks very well to Joan's qualities as a human being.
Jared Harris's portrayal of Lane's awkwardness and humiliation is so perfect and on point. And we can just feel the ick in this moment for Lane.
He just wants to shrink down to micro size and crawl under the carpet if he could.
 
 
Jenna: Next, we get a really quick scene between Ken and Peggy.
Ken knows Pete told Roger about his writing.
There's another fantastic line and line delivery here when Peggy goes,
you know, I don't blame Cynthia for being proud of your writing. She goes,
“I read the one in Galaxy about the girl who lays eggs. Wow.”
That's so great.
And I'm like, I kind of want to read that story, too, Ken.
 
Steve: It's a sad scene for Ken Cosgrove, though, because at least publicly.
And I get a sense this isn't just for show because, you know, he has a friendship with Peggy.
He's telling her that he has to give up his dream of writing because he just can't afford to be outed again.
 
And knowing how important the creative side is,
it hurts because it wasn't causing any problems. And we know the pettiness of Roger in trying to enforce it.
And it just seems like an awful consequence for Ken.
 
Jenna: I agree. I found it really sad. I don't want Roger to kill off this thing that is so fulfilling to him,
and it feels unnecessarily cruel.
 
 
Next we see Pete. He's scarred and limping out of the office with his briefcase.
And he sees Don in the elevator, probably the last person he wants to run into,
except maybe Lane.
 
And it's a weirdly Michael Scott assumption when Pete says, why are we fighting at work anyway? We're supposed to be friends.
 
Hey, Pete!
Friends don't tell each other they're unnecessary at the partners’ meeting!
Pete playing the victim is –
 
Steve: Yeah. In front of all the other partners.
 
Jenna: Pete is just so unlikable playing the victim here.
 
Steve: And we can see Pete is feeling really bad and feeling sorry for himself.
And he says, I have nothing, Don.
 
And that is such a striking contrast to just a few scenes earlier when he declares in the taxicab, I have it all.
And now he's admitting the truth, at least in this moment of his emotional duress. I have nothing.
And he's basically weeping.
And there's nothing Don Draper can even offer or say in response to it.
 
Jenna: This is a man who can't be happy unless he has everything he wants.
And I think, as with Betty, it can be hard to understand his unhappiness. But if you don't have love at your center, I think you doubt everything else.
 
Why do you think Pete is so unhappy?
Is it just pure selfishness and greed?
 
Steve: I think so.
I get the sense he's always measuring himself against everyone else,
and his definition of happiness is scoring higher or doing better than everyone else by every one of these measures, which I think just sets himself up for failure.
 
Because no matter how good it's going, no matter how wonderful his wife is or his baby daughter or his job or whatever it is,
you're always going to run into the Hansons of the driver's ed class or whatever, and it's like he's younger and better looking than you,
and you're just eclipsed.
 
So now you have a source of unhappiness that really, you should never have set yourself up for that evaluation and scorecard in the first place.
And you're just doomed to failure.
It's just this narcissistic treadmill that he can't get off of.
And I think it brings out the worst in his own behavior.
 
His triumphs are petty and unseemly,
and then his failures are depressing,
pathetic, and extremely sad.
 
So I do feel a little sorry for him in the elevator here at the end of this episode.
Although another side of me thinks about what he said in the meeting and thinks, you got what you deserved. And I'm thrilled that Lane is the one who put him down.
 
 
Jenna: At the end of the episode, we get this fantastic voiceover narration of Ken.
He's claiming a new pen name, writing a story called The Man With a Miniature Orchestra.
And even though Ken is angry at Pete for outing him as a writer to Roger,
he can still find pity for Pete and see his loneliness as he tells the story.
 
Steve: He's writing. So maybe he's going to just keep it from Cynthia in the future as well so that she can't spill the beans.
 
Jenna: She works at the publishing house courting him, so I'm pretty sure she's going to know.
[Laughter]
Kind of like I know about your other podcast.
 
 
As Pete sits in Driver's Ed and watches Hansen and Jenny together,
the slow faucet drip sound returns, and the closing song becomes Beethoven's Ode to Joy.
Amazing irony.
 
It's so dark and so sad. And I love that Mad Men can make me hate Pete so much. I hate that he cheats on Trudy and that he tries to date Jenny in this episode.
I hate how he treats Lane and how he tells on Ken. I'm still not over how he treated Peggy or the nanny or that thing with Trudy about publishing his story.
That was terrible.
 
And I still feel sad for him and his emptiness.
And I love that Mad Men can make me feel that way.
 
Steve: And now it's more of an action series, so I wonder who's going to have a fist fight in the next episode.
 
 
Jenna: Our listener shout-out today goes to Babe Louis. Thank you so much for your very kind comment about our show on YouTube.
We really appreciate you taking the time to leave such nice feedback, and and we're grateful to all our listeners who reach out through our website who follow us on social media and leave positive ratings and reviews of our show.
Thank you very much.
 
 
Steve: That's it for this episode of All Things Mad Men, from Chip and Dip to Zou Bisou. Visit our website, Mad Men C to Z dot com to vote for your favorite Sterling Lines, and to share your opinions on our Double Dip questions for each episode.
 
Jenna: You can find us on Instagram and YouTube at Mad Men C to Z, and please listen, like, and subscribe. That's what the podcast's for!
 
Steve: Thanks for listening, everybody.